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got all these ETFs now that they're in
it they've been promoting it they've
been touting it uh there's been Bitcoin
commercials now for years I mean the top
advertisers on cable TV are crypto
companies I mean they're pumping and
pumping and pumping and pumping and
spending a lot of money to try to con
the public and the buying this stuff uh
and so you know they've suckered a lot
of people in you know but that there's a
limit to how much longer they're going
to be able to do it you you can't do it
forever the bottom is going to drop out
you know
and as far as the NASDAQ look you know
yeah I mean there's a lot of liquidity
there's a lot of inflation it's been
driving a tech stocks higher I'm not
short these stocks I mean I think the
market could go up because I think the
dollar is going to go down but at least
in the tech stocks you know a lot of
these companies are real businesses they
may be overvalued but they have some
value uh they're gener you know you
mentioned a lot of companies that you
say have networks like Tesla or apple
but they make a ton of money selling
products right they they you know I got
a lot of Apple products myself apple is
earning a lot of money you know you can
argue about what the price of the share
should be but you can't argue that
there's a valuable business there uh but
with Bitcoin you know there is no
business it's nothing it's like you know
in in in sales that you know they say
sell the the sizzle not the stake well
in Bitcoin there is no stake it's just
Sizzle it's so it's all being hyped up
it's not certainly true because the
people who mine it get given block
rewards so they get paid if you're it
you make some money sure I'm not talking
about Bitcoin mining could be profitable
for now as long as I could sell it above
the cost of mining it but that that's
that's different but that creates inic
value selling Bitcoin business see Peter
it's the same as all mining if the cost
of
production is above the price of the
asset people don't
mind and so Supply is reduced or in this
case that the amount of hashing in the
network I the security the network gets
when it comes to bitcoin the supply has
really is very little to do with mining
because almost all the Bitcoin have
already been mined so the question is
with the 19 million odd Bitcoin that
exists right now forget about the couple
of million more that they could bring on
stream over the next few decades the
question is with the 19 million that
exist or however many haven't been
lost is do people want to hoard them or
do they want to sell them and if they
want to sell them is there enough new
demand to buy them not the price crashes
what happens if China sold its gold oh
the price crash happens if the FED sold
their
gold buy it somebody needs it this is
not an argument 10% of all gold Supply
is used for
industry so if a central bank comes in
and dumps their gold like the UK they
have dumped gold central banks have
dumped gold before
abbed in the market the price went
down and so maybe the price of Bitcoin
goes down when people sell it no
that's what markets do until you find
the clearing price it's normal I don't
see why it has to go to zero one of the
things that I've learned you know over
the years with Bitcoin is it is like a
religion and people believe in it the
way they believe in a religion or a cult
and when you get to that type of
mentality there's no rational argument
that you can make I can't I can't
logically try to tell somebody that
there's no God if they believe in a God
I mean it's a belief system that you
have and it's almost impossible to to
entertain uh that you might be wrong
right so and then you know so you
believe in it believe in it I mean
there's nothing I can do about it I mean
uh and if if if you end up losing a lot
of money you lose a lot of money and and
the problem is you know some people that
lose a lot of money can't afford it the
best thing about Bitcoin is that most of
the people who are going to lose a lot
of money are young and they got plenty
of time to earn it back and it's going
to be a valuable lesson that people
learn that they can carry into their
older years the memory of all the money
they lost in in Bitcoin could it
possibly be you that learns the lesson I
don't think
so okay I mean May Maybe I'm Wrong maybe
Warren Buffett is wrong maybe a lot of
smart investors you know maybe we all
got it wrong and and and you guys got it
right I I don't think that's the case
but you know I suppose anything is
possible what would have to happen for
you guys to reverse your opinion so Ral
what would have to be true of Bitcoin
down to zero for 10 years 100 years
whatever before you give up Peter same
to you what what would have to be true
for you guys to reverse your opinion for
me simply if people stop using the
network if if there's less activity on
the network people start becoming
disinterested then it's shown that it
store of value principles erode it would
be the same with gold and that's one of
the reasons gold has been somewhat
lackluster because there's been less
adopters of gold in a new digital world
so it's not done as well as it would
have done historically in the kind of
debasement environment that we've had so
if I were to observe in Bitcoin itself
forget all the other crypto and I'm no
Bitcoin maximalist as you all know um if
we saw that people were using it less
there was less activity less value was
being transacted less new people were
joining you know the Bitcoin Network I
having
wallets then I would say you know what
there's something wrong here and is that
persistent over time if it's persistent
over time then the network may not work
and we've seen many of those things
happen in the past there's a possibility
that happens I don't think it's the
highest probability certainly not this
decade could it happen after that of
course possible now why don't you worry
about that during the bare markets
because so for example in uh 2022 was a
great example is um the market went down
70 odd per
75% the number of uh active uh wallets
in crypto went up 22% uh 42% so adoption
was still ongoing while price went down
activity was less but then we're seeing
okay so if we step back and we hear oh
governments are going to build on
blockchain Rails
cbdcs all the banks want to put assets
on blockchain
Rails we're hearing gaming companies
want to put these metaverse gaming
experiences on blockchain
Rails we're hearing I was at the world's
largest one of the world's largest
commodity trading firms in switzland
last week speaking to their uh one of
their senior a agricultural Commodities
physical Traders and I'm like and she's
an investor in my digital asset um asset
management
company um and I'm like are you guys
using blockchain surely you should be
solving supply chain she goes oh we've
been using blockchain since
2021 so we are doing eight I think of
the world's largest agricultural
Commodities houses are putting their
letters of
credit their
shipping their um the the uh all of the
kind of Transit proofs the supply chain
and the settlement all on
blockchain so going back to your
question Tom when I see this and I see
the price of Bitcoin down 75% or the
whole crypto space down
80% you say I have to ask myself is
adoption
stopping or is just this a cyclical
Factor that's driven by the business
cycle and until I would see otherwise
unless these things go
away then I can only assume that
tomorrow is more digital than today and
tomorrow more people will use blockchain
technology than they did yesterday
simple as that Peter what would you have
to see for you to change your mind I
don't know it's going to be tough I mean
obviously it hasn't been changed yet I
mean I've been watching Bitcoin from a
few dollars a token to 60,000 right so
price obviously isn't going to do it um
you know the whole time I've been
observing Bitcoin and and and in
involved in interacting with the whole
community and I've seen it grow and I I
you know I've you know seen more and
more people uh you know believing in it
and and and speculating on it but what I
haven't seen is a use case you know
people make a big deal about oh Peter
shiff you know shift gold we accept
Bitcoin well we started early on with uh
working with bit pay uh where we enable
people to take their Bitcoin through bit
pay and bit pay just lets you sell your
Bitcoin kind of point a sale and get
dollars to buy gold uh but I I I haven't
seen any real increase it's a tiny part
of our business every once in a while
somebody buys gold with with Bitcoin uh
but they don't actually buy it with
Bitcoin they sell the Bitcoin and then
they buy the go with dollars but you
know I remember back in 2017 when
Bitcoin kind of popped on everybody's
radar for the first time because it kind
of went from obscurity and it had that
big run to 20,000 from you know under
1,000 and all of a sudden people start
talking about it a lot of companies
started to announce oh we're going to
we're going to sell products in Bitcoin
we're going to accept Bitcoin and there
was like a rush of that and that all
went away I mean nobody today is talking
about how they're taking Bitcoin I mean
the only
company AMC the movie the the the meme
stop for a while stock they they they
said oh we're going to take Bitcoin at
our theaters just part of the the Mania
you know that stock is down like 99% you
know since that I got hyped up
uh uh Elon Musk uh announced at one
point he was going to sell cars for
Bitcoin and I don't know how many months
later he pulled the plug on the whole
thing I said no we're not doing it
anymore but so we haven't seen that
adoption it hasn't it hasn't uh become
any more of a currency than it was when
it was first created that's a very fair
thing it hasn't because the problem is
it keeps going up so you're
disincentivized to sell it or it's very
volatile right it's not very good as a
currency well it's not very good at the
main thing it was designed for but and
and I remember when I first heard about
it when I first heard about Bitcoin the
way it was sold to me was hey you can
circumvent all the AML requirements you
don't have you get out of the banking
system you can transact anonymously in
private and you and you don't have to
worry about the government spying on you
you can be out of the banking system I
got into it for an entirely different
reason which is as Dan tapiero would
call it it's the security truth machine
it's the value of The Ledger
it's the value of having a new way of
creating trust in the world in a world
where trust is broken you don't know how
much gold the Federal Reserve has right
this is a trust problem we've got the
same trust problem with the future
doesn't have any I'm G to channel the
comment section right now and they are
all saying Peter Schiff is religious
about gold because Tom asked a question
what would need to be true for you to
change your mind and you've spent the
last five minutes telling us all the
reasons you won't change your mind well
I'm not talking about gold Gold's been
valuable for thousands of years it's not
like it's up to me what what would have
to be true for you to change your mind
about Bitcoin if the answer is nothing
that is religious conviction from where
I'm sitting I've been given the same
answer for you know for 10 years what
will prove me wrong about Bitcoin would
be if Bitcoin replaces the dollar the
Euro you know as a uh as a currency uh
when I go to the grocery store and not
only does the groc grocery store except
payment in Bitcoin but all the prices
are in Satoshi but do we do that with
that my
landord have have you gone to have you
gone to the supermarket with a gold bar
to buy a bag of CH no but gold is not
being used as money right now it's being
used as a commodity it's being used as a
metal Bitcoin can't be used as anything
so it it has to be a currency it was
created to be a currency so let me see
it function as a currency it hasn't done
that at all since it was created you're
applying a different set of Standards my
friend no I'm not it's like it's like
you're also asking me what would it have
what would have to happen for me to
believe that Santa Claus is real I don't
know you know I mean you're asking me
you it it's a fake asset it's phony I I
can't imagine what could happen to
convince me that something that isn't is
you know it's the the more question is
what gets you to stop believing in it
because you're the one that is that
believes in a fantasy I live in reality
so he answered that his answer just to
recap is that the energy in the network
adoption usage would have to go down
very finite totally understand but you
in your just gave a very concrete answer
uh I don't know how I'm less worried
about that
but I what I'm trying to do so I'm just
trying to paint a sense of what the base
assumptions are that build your guys's
worldview uh with that answer Peter I
it's very helpful um I come back to your
core thesis is if it isn't real physical
tangible and does not have real physical
tangible use cases then it it will never
cross your threshold it can be int it
doesn't have to be physical to be useful
but Bitcoin doesn't do anything right
all it is is a is a speculative vehicle
that I could trade I can yes I can hold
it and I can sell it but my ability to
sell it rests on the the the fact that
somebody else wants it and why would
somebody else want it because they think
they can sell it and they think they can
sell it at a higher price if they think
they can sell it at a lower price
they're not going to want it so the
demand for Bitcoin is a function of the
fact that everybody expects the future
price to be higher but the minute you no
longer have that expectation for an
appreciating price there's no buyers
there's not because there's nothing you
can do with it between the time you buy
it and the time you sell it and so it
just goes down there's no reason to own
it I am very much not trying to convince
you I simply want this position to be
understood you can still reject it and
say that doesn't work for you and i'
completely understand but um I think one
position that's worth putting on the
table would be that I look at the
economic situation that we're in right
now and I say I need a flight to safety
um so I have invested in Gold that that
is one potential flight to safety I have
unease about that because I have a
thesis that the every new child born now
is gonna believe in digital things more
than physical things in in this case now
I could end up being wrong and over time
that that will be in the wash but again
just just trying to be understood not
trying to be convincing um that the use
case then for someone with that belief
set becomes that if there are only 21
million there will only ever be 21
million and people keep losing them so
that number is actually deflating now I
have a place that mic people believe in
that I can I can buy and hold that I
don't need the price to be volatile in
fact with my personality I would rather
it was not volatile and now as it
matures there's no volatility or at
least low there's a place for me to um
Park my money that cannot be inflated
now I feel good buying Bitcoin today at
$60 odd, thousand of Bitcoin do you
think that's safe do you think it's a
safe place for your money do I think
it's safe no I don't think anything is
safe in a shorttime horizon on a
longtime Horizon right now it feels the
safest but even if even if in the short
run it can go from 60,000 to
20,000 you still think it's safe even
though you might need to sell it when
it's 20,000 well so again I I I don't
consider myself a a partner in this
debate I'm merely trying to steer it so
I just want to make sure that that that
idea
is understood again rejected is fine
just trying to place it as a thing to be
understood because I think this is the
core thing that breaks between again you
guys' archetypes that's where I think
this breaks is when I look at Bitcoin
and now I'm just speaking about Bitcoin
I see Ah that's that's an inflation head
that hedge that resonates with me
because I believe in the same thing that
R happens to believe in which is the
network effects just mimetically people
believe in it and then I ask myself is
tomorrow when I say is tomorrow going to
be more digital than today I mean will
people have a baseline understanding of
the world as a digital place or a
physical place I think they will have a
baseline understanding of the world as a
digital Place more than a physical place
now that that may have horrendous knock
on effects I'm I'm not even speaking to
that I'm just saying I think that is
where it's going maybe you're right
maybe you're wrong but regardless uh
buying Bitcoin is not safe it's it's
highly speculative you're speculating on
a bunch of things that you think might
happen but you're not playing it safe
nobody should operate under the delusion
that I'm buying Bitcoin because I want
to play it safe you're you you know you
should not put any money into Bitcoin
that you are not 100% willing to lose
all of it so if you're say yeah this is
risk money I could lose every penny that
I put into Bitcoin and I'm okay with
that I mean I hope I don't lose all my
money I hope it goes to the moon and I
buy a Lambo but if I lose it all I'm
okay because I got other resources that
I can fall back on you know that's how
you have to look at it you can't think
that oh I'm going to put my money on my
all my money in here because it's real
safe yeah I I think that's a very very
fair point and is exactly how I look at
it um so just to put a fine point on it
so uh for you to change your mind it
would have to become uh a currency that
replaces the dominant currencies in use
today yeah I'd have to achieve some kind
of scalability as a medium Exchange unit
of account and yeah eventually the
volatility would obviously have to go
away it have to stabilize you know you
know at some price it could gradually
rise you know over time slowly you know
depending on you know how much inflation
there is uh in other currencies but
maybe no other currencies maybe all the
other currencies go away and all that's
left is Bitcoin right that's all that's
all we have left there's no more Euro
there's no more Yen the US government
wants Bitcoin Bitcoin is how you pay
your taxes Bitcoin is if you get a
welfare check it's it's Bitcoin that's
what you get right if if this all this
happens then I guess I was wrong um but
if all it is is a speculative vehicle if
all we have is more ways to bet on the
direction of the price uh then nothing
has been proven and yeah the price could
go up Could It Go from 60,000 to 100,000
it could but it could go from 60,000 to
10,000 or a lot lower and my my question
would be and I'm sure if Bitcoin Falls
today from 60,000 to 20,000 or 10,000
all the people who have been telling me
how great it is they're they're not
they're going to be saying the same
thing they're and they're going to be
saying well don't worry it'll come back
it'll come back well maybe maybe not
maybe it won't come back you know maybe
it maybe the next time it really drops
it'll just drop again there's no way to
know you know they always say past
performance is no a guarantee of future
results so just because Bitcoin has come
back in the past doesn't mean it's going
to come back in the future do you do
speculative investing do you have a
portion of your portfolio yeah I mean I
I mean I've been buying that's I said I
bought a lot more gold stocks this week
I regard that as highly speculative but
I bought I bought them I thought I think
you know I think they're cheap I think
I'm going to make a lot of money on my
gold stocks we'll see uh but I know I'm
speculating I didn't buy I didn't buy
any physical gold at I but I bought gold
stocks now when I buy gold stocks I own
some physical gold because the gold
mining companies have gold in the ground
they haven't mined it yet so as a as a
stockholder I have a share of that un
gold okay as uh for both of you as spec
when you're speculatively investing do
you look for volatility or do you avoid
it well if I'm speculatively investing
I'm looking for
volatility with a risk adjusted return
that I think is in my favor obviously we
get bets wrong we get bets right that's
the idea so you you look for a strong
trending asset with some hypothesis that
is relatively provable over time that
should continue to drive the asset
whether it's the Indian stock market a
technology company or Bitcoin or even
gold volatility is something you want if
you're a Trader I mean if you're trying
to trade a lot volatility to trade but
when I talk about speculating in an
asset like a mining
company I'm not looking for the
volatility I'm looking to buy something
that I think is cheap but I'm also
hoping that there's a catalyst so that
in the future it will become expensive
and so I want to buy something when I
think it's cheap and not a lot of other
people want to buy it and I I want to
hold it till I think it's expensive and
everybody wants to buy it and I may be
wrong right I'm making a gamble because
I'm betting on things changing I'm
betting on whatever exists today
whatever perception people have that
those perceptions are wrong and they're
going to change in the future and so I
don't care about volatility I mean I
just want to buy I I want I care about
price I want a low price uh and um and
what I like about the gold stocks is
nobody really owns them there's just a
handful of people that if you if you
look at the major uh you know holders
institutions endowments Pension funds
hedge funds they own either no gold
stocks or just a tiny amount but most of
them don't own any in fact I I joked on
my podcast you know there was the
nvidia's increase in its market cap in a
single day B basically exceeded the
entire gold mining industry in one day
just the gain not the market cap of the
whole company just the increase on that
one day uh so it's a tiny little segment
of the market that has the potential to
be a lot less tiny you know and if
that's the case you know I I can make a
lot of money in these stocks meanwhile I
do get some dividends a lot of my gold
stocks are not my best dividend payers I
mean but I three four% dividend so I
collect some interest some income on a
lot of these gold stocks uh but I'm
giving up some income because I get
better yields in other Investments but I
think there's a lot of potential for
appreciation I recognize I could be
wrong in which case I don't get the
appreciation but I think you know some
of these stocks could go up five or
tenfold some of them the smaller ones
could go up 50 or 100 fold so I I I
think there's a lot of uh upside
potential relative to the the downside
risk in these stocks so that's why I'm
I'm buying them but I look at them as
speculative if you had a time machine
you could go back in time and buy
Bitcoin 10 years ago would you do it of
course I mean I'm not an idiot well
first of all if I had a time machine I
could do a lot of things I you know uh
and I i' you I'd be the you know but of
course look you know yes do I regret I
mean I remember when I was sitting at my
desk my studio in Connecticut in Weston
and a guy working with me on my campaign
they were showing me Bitcoin and a guy
was like look just buy some you know
what the hell and I looked at it and I
don't remember if it was under a dollar
or over a dollar because I can't
remember but I remember it was like 2010
when I looked at it and I remember I
thought about it yeah should I I mean I
can throw 10 grand in it 50 Grand I
don't know I thought about it and I
didn't do it I was like ah you know this
is ridiculous what am I you know I I
just I I I went away from it but I
thought about it I I thought about all
the odds and I I I didn't see this kind
of bubble potential I mean I thought
yeah maybe it could go up but I just
didn't want to deal with it now
obviously do I wish I had made a
decision
to have thrown 10 grand 50 Grand 100
Grand into it sure yeah I may be worth
hundreds of millions assuming I didn't
sell but again I don't know what I would
have done had I made that decision maybe
I would have put it all on Mount goau
and I lost it there but I don't know
maybe some of the mount gaw's money is
coming back um I don't know what I would
have done if I had bought it but yeah
clearly I mean I I mean I wish I'd have
bought it but you know I I would even if
I had bought it even if I would have
bought it I wouldn't have told other
people to buy it I would have had to
kept quiet about it because I never
believed in it so I would have bought it
just betting on other people being dumb
enough to buy it and pay a higher price
right I I wouldn't have bought it
because I actually believed in it I
would have bought it because I believed
other people would be would be foolish
enough or greedy enough to buy it so I
would have had to kept it quiet I
couldn't have like encouraged other
people to buy so I would have I I I so I
think publicly I I wouldn't have had a
different you know I would would have
been singing the same song I just would
have made a lot of money if I would have
if I would have bought it so you don't
think there's a remote chance you might
have been more enthusiastic about it had
you have bought it been involved in the
community made some money attended some
of these conferences saw what's going on
with the technology could it have been a
different pet of shiff and it could have
been shiff crypto written on the wall
there I think there's a chance it could
have been and maybe you missed it well
look I like to think that I have
integrity and that I would have had the
same Outlook but is it possible that had
I bought it like so many other people
did might the fact that it went way
up might I have decided that rather than
being a lucky Gambler I was some kind of
a
genius and I I I I maybe operated under
the same delusion I mean it's possible
look you know there's you know power
corrupts so maybe money corrupts or it
distorts your perception I mean it's
it's easy for me to see the bubble when
I'm not inside it so maybe if I was in
the bubble with you guys maybe if I was
a crypt billionaire uh uh maybe maybe
maybe that would distort my perception
so maybe I would be maybe I would be out
there you know just as crazed as you
guys pet in what world do you think it's
acceptable to insult asset holders and
think that's a normal thing that they're
idiots they can't see it they're
Speculator why is why is that become an
acceptable way of
interaction I don't do it to Apple
shareholders well I mean or I mean it's
not it's not so there's a there's a some
sort of psychology around gold that it
feels like it's being threatened and
that therefore there's an attack there's
an attack going back I mean it's kind of
strange remember I I I I talked to a lot
of people during the 1990s who were in
love with various doc stocks and they
all went to zero I talked to a lot of
people who thought they would get rich
owning their home and multiple homes
during the the the real estate bubble
and so I know the psychology and and the
way people act when they're trapped in a
bubble and they can't see it now there
were plenty of smart people that own
these stocks that went to zero there are
plenty of SM smart people that own real
estate so I'm not saying there there are
some really smart people I mean
intellectually smart high IQ smart that
own Bitcoin I'm not saying they're dumb
I'm just saying they're making a mistake
and their judgment is being clouded by
the money uh they can't think everything
is going to be obvious in hindsight see
a lot of the things that I was saying
when I was warning about uh the housing
bubble and the subprime market a lot of
the things I was saying in 2003 and four
and five and six that were being
dismissed all of a sudden people were
saying the same thing oh oh yeah of
course yes yes this that's Peter are
house prices higher or lower than they
were then are technology stocks higher
or lower than they were a a lot of them
went to zero it doesn't matter most of
Nas zero yes if you bought Amazon if you
bought you know uh uh you know uh uh
eBay you know if you bought there are
some stocks that made it but if you
bought pets.com or the globe.com you
lost everything there were a lot of
stocks most of them went to zero you
just need to own NASDAQ it's an index
and it has the top 100 technology
companies so the bad ones get dropped
out the good ones survive and you made
an enormous amount of money by backing
technology but you're saying that people
were stupid to buy technology in 1999 no
I'm talking about individual stocks that
I'm talking about people were they
people they were cult like you would
have picked the stocks better than those
people for sure because you saw it was
all a bubble the NASDAQ the NASDAQ went
down from 5,000 to a th000 so it went
down 80% and the only reason it didn't
go down 90% was because the FED slashed
interest rates to 1% so you had the FED
rescue the market it's up
15x I know where it is now it's another
bubble so let's see where the let's see
where the next bottom is you know I mean
it's not I mean we're going it's a
Serial bubble blowing it's the same
inflation that you're talking about that
is driving these asset bubbles I'm not
I'm not denying that that happen
happened you know and I own I own some
stocks that are into technology that
have gone up 10 I I don't own none of
these stocks I I have some so out of
Interest what value do you get out of
owning your gold what is it that it does
for you gold gold gold is a small part
of my portfolio physical gold but it's a
it's a store of value it's a safe haven
it's an insurance policy it's it's I I
look at gold what against what Peter rob
when you ask me why do I own gold you
should say why do you own dollars why do
you have dollars in the bank account why
do you have Euros or Yen right why don't
I just spend all my dollars and buy
assets buy real estate buy stocks see
gold is liquidity for me it is an
alternative to the dollar to the euro
it's not an alternative to real estate
it's not really an alternative to
stocks uh it's an alternative to to the
dollar so what are you most overweight
in do you think your your
savings um mainly in real estate or you
know how do you think well those are
investments savings can be in Gold but
you real estate would be an investment
unless it's my you know my primary
residence or something then it's more as
an investment you're speculating and
going up right because that's what an
investment is well an investment would
have an income component so if I have
real estate I got rental income if I own
stocks I have dividend income uh so my
my my investments are generating a
return uh you know if you're speculating
you know you're you're betting on
is is Amazon an investment well Amazon
it doesn't pay a dividend right so I'm
confused because it sounds like it's a
bad investment for well Amazon has
earnings so it could pay a dividend if
it wanted to but it's reinvesting it
could do but it doesn't that makes it
okay okay but but you're asking me do I
think Amazon is a good buy no I don't I
think Amazon is is overpriced it's
obviously been overpriced for a long
long time you know and and and and that
hasn't stopped it from going up but I do
think that there is a major decline in
Amazon's future whether it happens in
nominal terms or in real terms so
nominal terms would be the dollar price
goes down in real terms the gold price
goes down but one of those two things is
going to happen I don't own Amazon I
mean I'm a I'm a good customer we buy
from Amazon every every day so I know
they you know there there's definitely
value in that business model the
question is what's it worth you know
what's the what should the price be and
I think the market has overpricing it
for a long time if you like that clip
check out the full powerful episode here
and I'll see you there