Kind: captions
Language: en
everybody Welcome to impact Theory you
were here my friends because you believe
that human potential is nearly Limitless
but you know that having potential is
not the same as actually doing something
with it so our goal with this show and
Company is to introduce you to the
people and ideas that will help you
actually execute on your dreams all
right today's guest is one of the most
accomplished college basketball players
of all time he's a two-time college
player of the year you unanimous pick
for the 2002 All-American first team
he's a three-time Duke All-American and
he rocked his time at Duke so hard that
they retired his number and it now hangs
in the rafters with their other Legends
and it didn't end there he was drafted
number two overall by the Chicago Bulls
in the 2002 NBA draft he took over
Michael Jordan's locker and became the
face of the future of the team his
success was also financially
transformative he was a
multi-millionaire by the time he was 21
he was dripping in cars clothes and cash
from his lucrative endorsements and the
millions that he was banking per year
allowed him to put his parents on
payroll erasing all of their struggles
with money as well he had it all then in
an instant he found himself bleeding to
death laying next to his destroyed
motorcycle and like that it was all gone
he had crashed into a utility pole going
70 M an hour without any protective gear
his pelvis and left leg were ruined over
10 surgeries and months in the ICU were
required just to stabilize him and it
was unclear if he'd ever walk again
after years years of grueling rehab he
still failed to make his much dreamed
about comeback to the NBA realizing that
he was now without the sport that had
come to Define him he slid into the
grips of depression and rebuilding
emotionally proved even more difficult
than coming back physically it was a
fight so brutal that it would see him
attempt suicide twice but today not only
is he still here he's thriving having
pulled himself from the depths of
depression to carve an incredible New
Path as one of the most popular ESPN
analysts a much sought-after
motivational speaker entrepreneur and
member of the board of USA Basketball so
please help me in welcoming the king of
transformation the managing partner of
the leverage agency the author of The
Beautiful raw and uplifting
autobiography life is not an accident
the Unstoppable
J
Williams thanks for having me I really
appreciate it my pleas yours too dude
that that goes an equal measure I that
was one hell of an intro well thank you
wow reading your book The the way you
open it is so powerful but like the
writing is amazing so forget that the
story in and of itself is like on
inspiring and transformational it's just
well written man so crazy Kudos thank
you and that really was what fed into
the um the intro was it's this beautiful
narrative and you really take people on
this crazy emotional
journey I think the most powerful gift
that you could give our audience would
be to talk about like what does it take
to come back mentally from okay hey I'm
going to be the next big I mean you
literally were the next big thing it
goes away in an instant you have to
rebuild what is that process wow um
I I think the first thing is recognizing
that you are not what you do right and
for me this uh this Monumental thing I
was able to accomplish as far as getting
drafted was a dream come true just not
for me but uh for all these young guys
that get drafted NFL MLB NBA you win a
lottery your family feels like they've
made it so you you carry this weight of
I'm the way out for everybody um so it
took me a very long time to find out who
the hell Jay Williams was without the
sport of basketball but I think one of
the things that I did that was extremely
beneficial is that I love business right
and um my dad worked for AMX for 20 plus
years and that was one of our goals you
know the more money I made in basketball
I just wanted to use that platform to
leverage to build a business I had no
idea what business that was yet uh we
were still ideating in the process of me
playing but when when my accident
happened you know you know after I went
through multiple surgeries one of the
things that inspires me is when you see
businesses that have really good boards
and all the CEOs I've ever met you know
if you talk to them a day or two before
they're going into their board meeting
they're nervous right they're they're
anxious their palms are sweaty because
they have to present to the board me
Members about where the company was
where the company is and where the
company is going and the steps that he
took in order to help the company either
to their demise or to their benefit
so it was the first time I started
thinking about myself wow why don't
individuals hold themselves to the same
level companies do and I started think
who who Who's on Jay Williams board and
at the time you know I talk about this
in my book uh cuz I was 23 years old uh
couldn't play basketball anymore I had a
17 18-year- old drug dealer who was on
my board right it was a guy that just
ended up talking to and I still was
taking oxycotton because I was addicted
to it from my accident um I had friends
who were doing careless things who were
on my board um I didn't have the
foundation of the people that needed to
help me be where I wanted to be and it
was the first time I started looking at
that and saying okay you know I'm going
to have multiple boards I'm going to
surround myself with people that make me
better if that was Pastor Carl who is
like a brother to me who runs Hill song
You Know United right that church and
you know help me be a better human being
right with the women who were in my life
or you know just finding God or whatever
that may be being even with my own
business uh like CEOs like Carl lebert
who I saw saw the way he was with his
his family there was no um he balanced
going to work and then his family the
importance of family and how much he
loved his wife and his kids and I
started building out my board man ever
since I built out my board they've held
me accountable and uh I was gruesome
because I went through the process of
going through my you know the the
negatives and the positives and them
telling me well look you lie you lied
for random reasons little petty white
lies that you didn't need to tell you're
not accountable you say you're going to
be somewhere you don't show up you're
late uh you you know get depressed very
quickly if I challenge you and you're
hearing all this stuff and as I'm
writing this stuff down it really
resonated with me I was like wow okay
these these are some of my weaknesses
that the people around me who love me
who have done things the right way see
in me and how do I work on those and
that was the first step in me taking
towards me finding out who I was and
where I want it to be where did you
develop that sense like hearing you talk
so having read the book I know when you
say you were depressed like you were
depressed right legitimately trying to
kill yourself so the to be able to then
bring people into your life not to
mollycoddle you but to like really force
you to look at the things that you're
doing wrong and I'm going to guess that
that's also what made you great at
basketball how did you develop that
sense of I actually need to get good
like it's not enough to tell a story I
actually have to be better at whatever
than any anybody else well that was a
gift and the curse of my mentality when
I played I was always a kid that didn't
receive the recognition um early in my
life everybody else got it so you know
for me I remember the first time I got
my first letter from a college was going
into my junior year and my head coach in
high school guy named Mark Taylor I
still love you to this day Mark but he
was like you need to commit to forom you
need to go to forom right now I don't
know if the opportunity is going to be
better for you and I remember thinking
to myself W okay like do I do I commit
to the first school that sent me a
letter or do I have this tattoo my wrist
where actually the first time I try to
commit suicide I try to cut my wrist
that says believe cuz my mother's always
talked about either if you don't believe
in yourself then who's going to believe
in you um and I think that was one of
the benefits of being an athlete that
was always overlooked in my opinion it
forced me to work harder and force me to
put my head down now there's some
disadvantages to that too you can get
lost in the work process and not be
present to some of the things that are
happening in your life but I I I think
that mentality and and being around
people that inspired me
not by their words but more so by their
actions uh I hear a lot of people talk
every single day and I was one of these
guys Tom when I when I was playing you
know you're 21 years old you have no
idea who the hell you are um you're
trying to learn on the process and you
try to do things the right way but I
think for everybody you get into this
preachy thing about look at me and look
about what I do and I started not to
listen to what people said but started
to watch how people acted and how they
interacted with other people and that
helped me set the bar for where I want
to be you've talked a lot about that
notion of like setting the bar and that
the board or people that hold you to a
higher standard um is that like a core
belief for you like that you're only
going to succeed like at whatever level
you put the bar I don't know if I have a
bar anymore um I I think I just I always
want to get better I think I'm a little
bit Relentless in that in that capacity
which can be draining for some people um
for for people like romantically people
like is that what you mean or I think
both um you know I this is actually the
relationship that I'm in now is probably
one of the most challenging
relationships that I've ever been in
because she forces me to address issues
I mean we all have issues right uh to
some degree and there there're issues I
have relationship wise too but when
somebody forces you to address and you
allow yourself to be vulnerable and you
try to communicate the worst Parts about
who you are um that overall that that
sheds you right it it's it's so
rewarding to almost feel like you you're
coming clean that's what writing my book
was for me right nobody knew I tried to
attempt at suicide I thought that you
know gave insight into my weakness but
you know then you start talking to other
friends you know one of my really good
friends who was my lawyer got a divorce
his wife up and left him really didn't
go through therapy just kind of on the
whim was gone and I started thinking
about for the first time wow that that's
his accident I'm watching him go through
the same thing I went through just in a
different vertical a different Silo um
so helping other people address their
issues while I'm still I'm still
learning myself um I'm only 35 years old
I don't have all the answers too so I I
think I'm starting to appreciate the
process and uh I found relevance in the
process of it's not always going to be
easy there going to be challenges
there're still going to be curveballs
thrown at me but I I I can't become uh
introverted I I I have to continue to
get outside myself because when you're
uncomfortable that's the only way you're
going to grow right I I love that and
those are like words to live by in my
opinion um one of the things that I
loved about your book that you were just
touching on is you were crazy raw crazy
vulnerable and in that like it made me
trust you which one thing that I find is
when you lower your defenses you're not
trying to posture um there's so much
power in that I want to read you one of
the quotes that you put in book cuz this
was the moment where I was like okay I
I'm like I'm with you now like up till
that point like I was trying to
understand but then when I read this I
was like I'm with you um if I tell you
I've made peace with this don't believe
me I will never be fully at peace
knowing that my fate wasn't for lack of
talent or an erosion of skill caused by
age but rather a direct result of one
stupid decision that refused to release
its hold on me how do you think about
that cuz you've talked about like where
are if it if it's not that you've made
peace with it like what is your
relationship to what happened it's an
ongoing process I'm not going to tell
you it doesn't piss me off sometimes
when you're watching the game and you
know more so For the Love of the Game
now than for the monetary value that
came along with the game I think for 10
plus years after my accident I was I
held a lot of animosity because like I
see guys that I was better than that I
thought I was better than I thought I
was better than everybody I mean that's
can't you have to be crazy to be great
at something right um and seeing these
guys that were signed this $ 135 $150
million contract and that used to sit
with me so I so angry about it like the
guy doesn't deserve that I know things
that that guy does and not that I was
saying that stuff out publicly but
that's the conversations you have in
your mind and you you start having this
conversation with yourself and God like
you know why the hell me like what did I
do to deserve this pain for the rest of
my life right um so it did it did sit
with me it still does sit with me to a
certain degree I'm not I'm not angry
about it anymore um but I still missed
the game that was once my safe haven you
know for me growing up Tom like you know
my every relationship is different okay
um my dad worked a lot he spent a lot of
time in New York City uh my mother went
back to school while she was a guidance
counselor to finally become
principal there is a history of domestic
violence in my house um I think learning
about who the who I was and why I made
my mistake allowed me to open my eyes up
to finally forgive my father about the
mistake that he made with my mother now
I don't know if my mother will ever
forgive my father for that but for me it
was a process of learning about life in
general and about hey who I was 15 years
ago maybe I wasn't trying to be the best
version of me lot it's amazing how many
people you talk to don't actually think
for a second about trying to become
better you're so busy in the minutia in
the the Clutter that you're running
through your life with your head down
and uh it was the first time I had to
sit in the evaluate and that process
within itself is rewarding peaceful to
my soul and my spirit but
still still drives me because I still
know I have such a long way to go and I
I have to continue the process it never
stops right yeah I mean I really in fact
I'll just address this directly to you
guys read the book like there when you
see the way that he can talk about the
fact that there was domestic abuse and
yet still clearly paint the picture of
how not okay that is and yet how much
love there was still in the household
like I'll never be able to capture it
but in the book it was really incredible
and it was one of the ways that you uh I
felt like you were coming to terms with
sort of the imperfections of everything
and like finding a path through life and
and doing something interesting and I
want to go back to um the concept of you
have to be crazy to be great at
something so I've never heard it put
like that I I agree with that so like
violently that when you said it I wanted
to like flip my chair up and scream like
you literally and this goes back and it
is so [ __ ] poetic dude that when you
tried to commit suicide and I know life
isn't a poem but like the fact that you
tried to scratch through that yeah when
I was I the chills again but it gave me
the chills when I read it in the book I
was like oh my God like literally I was
like you can't make this [ __ ] up the
fact that you were trying to scratch
that word out in particular but that
that was the thing that had already made
you great and of course at that point
I'm like prognosticating into the future
of the book and I'm going I promise it
comes back to at some point he begins to
believe in himself in something else and
he's and of course you do and like we'll
get into the ESPN thing and how you end
up getting really [ __ ] great at that
by practicing and doubling down and
getting good but talk to me like when
did you a when did you develop it do you
remember like cultivating that sense of
okay I'm not getting the feedback so I
have to believe in me um was it
something that you were just naturally
had like how did that notion of you have
to be crazy to be great find its way
into your mind uh first I've seen it on
a multitude of levels um you know it was
really funny my rookie year you get so
damn excited because you're playing
against these guys that you've been
dreaming of [ __ ] playing against your
entire life right you actually crossed
over Jordan right uh well yeah I I I did
even though he he dropped multiple
buckets on me um and then told me how he
was going to do it which was impressive
because he was 40 years old it still
pisses me off to this day I don't know
if you can tell um but I remember we
were playing against the Lakers Tom and
we were out here in LA and um you know
look I I always try to outwork people
right that's just how I made my mark so
the game was at 700 I was like you know
what I'm going to come to the stable
Center cuz we're playing this one Lakers
had Kobe and Shaq okay this is this is
like the championship Lakers I like you
know I'm going to get there at 3:00 and
I want to make sure I make 400 made
shots before I go back into the room and
then I sit in the S and I get ready for
the game so you know get in the car get
to the gym get there and as I'm walking
onto the court who do I see I see Kobe
Bryant already working out and I'm like
okay it's kind of cool it's Kobe what's
up Kobe you know and uh you know so I'm
put my sneakers on and do you ever get
lost in what you do where you end up
like wait it's been an hour and a half
like I'm just I'm I'm here I'm in it so
once I set my foot across that line I
started working out and so I worked out
for a good hour hour and a half and when
I came off after I was done I sat down
and of course I still heard the ball
bouncing I look down I'm like this guy's
this guy's still working out he's he was
working out like it looks like he was in
a dead sweat when I got here and he's
still going and it's not like his moves
are nonchalant or lazy he's doing like
game moves you know um I sit there and I
unlace my shoes I'm like I want to see
how long this goes I sit out there and
watch 25 minutes and he got done I was
like okay I think I've seen enough go
play you know come back get in sauna get
ready for the game that game he drops 40
on us okay and after the game is over
I'm like I I have to ask this guy I I
have to understand and like why why he
he works like that so after the game I'm
like hey Co like why why were you in the
gym for so long he's like cuz I saw you
come
in and I I wanted you to know that it
doesn't matter how hard you work that
I'm willing to work harder than you wow
and he's like it's don't hold there's
nothing wrong with that like I'm not
saying I dislike you as a person you
just you inspire me to be better right
and it was the first time I started to
see this level of competitiveness where
I said I need to start doing more right
wow like and and everybody that I've
been around my life who's been Uber
successful and I'm not talking
monetarily even talking
spiritually my girlfriend says something
to me that really inspires me okay cuz I
think as I as I got lost into my career
and I want to jump the story as I get
lost into my TV career I had a tendency
to put all my energy and my time into
that almost to make up for what I felt
like I lost before okay and she said you
know what if you were to allocate a
percentage of the energy that you put
into your career into yourself and
learning more about yourself and
learning more about yourself in
relationships you'll be successful and
it was the first time I had to sit back
and say wow that's that's really
powerful because I think a lot of people
when you have to start addressing other
things you get mentally tired right uh
when I address TV I don't get mentally
tired this is what I do right but when
there's an unknown something that you
haven't felt like you mastered I don't
I'm unsure about it when it gets
frustrating like you know who are you
going to be are you going to be that
person that Wows in their self-pity or
you're going to be that person that says
you know what okay I did this wrong I
did that wrong but how can I be better
and I think that's what I talk about
that Relentless mentality to want to be
better at just life in general I love
that and how hilarious that you would
use the word Relentless so you and I
have uh a mutual a deep friend for you
I'm sure and uh a very strong
acquaintance for me in Tim Grover
somebody who's had a massive impact on
my life but obviously pales in
comparison to what he's done for you
talk to me about Tim his notion of being
relentless what that means to you and
your own willingness to endure an
ungodly amount of suffering H uh that
would be an understatement with Tim um
first off he is brilliant he's Beyond
brilliant and it wasn't the physical
part that was arduous it was it was the
mental and just to said the stage for
people he was the guy that trained you
post injury when it's like I'm really
serious about this I'm gonna go all the
way I go to the best of the best Tim
Grover yeah and uh you know Tim had
trained Michael Jordan he trained Kobe
Bryant but I think a lot of people get
lost in the fact that he trained them
physically he trained these guys
mentally too and I know for me you know
my leg I have atrophy on the outside of
my left leg okay this muscle here since
I lost my nerve I it's gone away
and I have drop foot so my game had to
change and very much like life you're
used to doing one thing at 21 is
different than when you're 35 years old
right um and I had to be open enough and
vulnerable vulnerable enough to accept
the fact that my game had to be
different in order for me to be
effective right but like I said earlier
it's so hard when my brain sees things
in my body before I guess this is a gift
of being an athlete to that caliber it
right I see gone right if I bringing the
ball down the court and there's a screen
coming you know to your right and you
glance over if I see your eye glance
within that Split Second I'm gone right
cuz I see you take your eye off of me so
now sudden my gamees changed at 21 years
old now sudden that first step is like
it's molasses it's non-existent right so
now am I willing to say I'm not that
fast anymore I have to work you into the
screen I have to take my time I have to
actually come off shoulder to- shoulder
um I have to use my body more to create
separation hey my jump shot wasn't the
best I have to be a better shooter
because I don't have that explosion
anymore and a lot of people say hey that
seems pretty easy but to mentally accept
that I'm a different person now um and
to help other people see I'm a different
person was was challenging and the major
part that was the most difficult
was seeing
myself so as an athlete I was used to to
people looking at me in a state of awe
right and it was something you kind of
you thrive for you work your entire life
for so when the kid or when somebody was
would come up to me they're like oh my
God Tom like your show is amazing right
and you're used to that affirmation of
what you do you're like all right it's
worth me putting in the time whereas
that look for me changed and that look
really made me depressed too because it
was a look from oh my God you're amazing
to a look of oh my God I'm so sorry
sorry right or what what happened or
used to be that guy before you you
messed up and people don't say things
maliciously they say things more so
because they're it's awkward and they
want to start a conversation and those
things would drive me insane and Tim
forced me to talk to him about those
things it was the first time I started
having conversations I'm like on the
court I'll be on the court doing a drill
and he's like you have drop foot and all
I would attack the drill a little bit
more and you know next drill like you
know it used to be a guy you were good
and I would let's get up more shots so
he he started to find ways to motivate
me and started to take the anger out of
the equation for me too and that was a
that was a hell of a first step in the
process of me rebuilding who I was as a
person so I'm wearing this shirt in
particular for you because there are
people that know how to Leverage The
Darkness there are people that know how
to leverage the anger Tim is definitely
one of them you've said that you've
always always played better angry um
what was your mental talk in those times
where you the the level of pain which
you go into great detail in the book the
level of pain was like I was squeamish
just reading about it I mean it's just
crazy I can't imagine I get sweaty just
talking about it I'm sure I mean when
you have to do years of that kind of
painful stuff is nuts so what are you
doing like selft talk how are you
harnessing like the the dark side like
how did you tap into that did you and
work on that was that something that was
part of the game plan well we had
conversations about different things um
which obviously you know for me at that
time I was 23 years old right so was the
first time I was even have conversations
and and to a degree you know I think
this comes from being at a school like
Duke when you're always you're always in
you know in the face of the media you
learn how to say the right thing right
okay um you don't give people your
honest feedback you you kind of give
them the rhetoric and I think even when
I started going through therapy um I had
a lot of a lot of rhetoric right um
because I don't I didn't want to I
didn't want to face it I
I have youever had a bad dream and you
wake up and you're married right yes and
you see your wife and you're like okay
that was a dream right right I think for
a long time for two or three years I
thought I was living a [ __ ] up dream
and I kept waiting to wake up I kept
waiting to wake up W up Tim was the
first person that forced me to talk to
talk just to talk and it's amazing when
you just open your mouth and you start
saying how you really feel about stuff I
mean think about how many people really
say how they feel virtually nobody
exactly and I think Tim was the first
person I actually started to have like
full transparence transparent
conversations with right I was like I
don't like the person I was he's like
what do you mean I was like I cheated a
lot on my girlfriend I lied a ton I was
consumed buy money I used to gamble I
never gambled um you know I I would say
things just because it was the right
thing to say not that I was maliciously
a bad person right I just never even
thought about what my actions were I was
too busy moving and uh Tim forced me to
stop and um I still stopped myself to
this day and you stop yourself from what
focusing on who you don't want to be and
focus on who you do want to be I I just
I press pause in life sometimes and I
think it it helps
um I I I recalibrate to try to get out
of an obsessive thought yes or just to
you know even to get out of funks
whatever whatever may be you know I'm a
firm believer in that you have to find
balance in life right so there going to
be times where your your journey is
going to be down here and it's going to
be tough um and the same when things get
high you know you sign a new deal or you
you know you have to be able to keep
things in perspective and I think
sometimes when I stop I force myself to
assess okay what are the what are the
benefits you know where are the ne
negatives um how can I how can I turn
this negative into a positive all right
let me make sure that I don't get too
high and I continue to keep my head down
and work harder because I I want to
achieve more if it's not for me for the
people that work for me or for my
girlfriend or my mom deserves better so
I try to find that one thing because I'm
very goal oriented um that I I need to
work towards and once I achieve that
it's another goal and I I don't want it
to ever stop because that's what life
should be agreed do you think of
yourself as young young or old I'm old
interesting um um I I lived a life that
has been
different U Not For Better or For Worse
it's just I feel like I'm an old soul
it's interesting I ask because I'm
intrigued to I think what your story is
and I'm going to reveal myself and my
worldview in this so I'm reading your
story you want to make the comeback and
because the way the book is told I
didn't know if you make the comeback or
not right so I'm I don't follow Sports
so I didn't know like does this guy like
go back to the NBA and crush it and like
he's like super famous now or um or do
you not and there's no hints of it in
the beginning of the book so it's like
unfolding for me in real time and and
then when you don't make it and there's
the second attempted suicide but I know
that like you're I I have the framework
of what you do Post basketball so I
didn't know if it was basketball injury
basketball and then post post or just
basketball injury and then post but I
know what you do post so I'm like okay
this works out somewhere like at some
point he gets back on
track and I am utterly convinced that
and I don't believe things happen for a
reason by the way which I know you and I
are diametrically opposed on that so
yeah I don't believe but I believe that
there's so much meaning and power to be
taken from anything that happens so to
me looking at like okay I watch this kid
nobody gives him enough um accolades for
how good he's getting and he actually
understands the nature of getting good
it's about practicing it's about showing
up it's about putting in the work it's
about doing more than other people are
willing to do he goes to college at Duke
not impressed with himself in his first
season but oh dear God kills himself
over the summer to really get
spectacular comes back crushes it could
have gone direct to the NBA feels a
sense of obligation which I think is
beautiful and even though there's no
question you could have made more money
by going into the NBA finally maybe that
was a better decision but I'm imagining
you at the podium and everyone's like
begging you for another year and you
give it to them and I think that's
[ __ ] beautiful man I think that was a
gift to that town it's why your jersey
now hangs in the rafters like you did
something beautiful for that
organization I think it's incredible you
do that you go into the NBA it's all
turning to [ __ ] people are smoking weed
like before games there it's like a
total mess you're becoming somebody you
don't want to be but by the end of the
season you figur it out and Crush the
last 19 games if I'm not mistaken and
everybody's like wo the person you're
becoming you're about to become an
All-Star and then like it's a [ __ ]
movie that's the moment that you have
the accident you have to rebuild we've
already talked about that but your mind
has been consistent through everything
okay the vast majority of humanity if I
take your life and I just take a million
people and I crush them through that
like the the percentage of people that
come out the other side is virtually
none so for you like it's the way that I
think of the inner cities the inner
cities consume most of the people that
it touches and they either literally Die
Young or they just go on to do nothing
but every now and then you get Jay-Z and
you go God for the right person like
this pressure cooker is it it's the
pressure that makes the diamond right so
because a I think that I'm going to live
forever truly and I understand a lot of
things have to happen for that to be
true but I extend that to you you're
even younger than I am so you're going
to live forever it's going to be amazing
so now I want to see okay I know what
this guy's been through I know the
diamond that his mind has become like
what awaits all of us on the other side
of that so that's why I was freaking out
reading the book when you're when you
literally try to cut through the word
believe and can't by the way um what do
you set huge goals for yourself now yes
every day and let me let me address one
other thing that you said that I find
fascinating because I I think it's uh
it's an epidemic with in our culture um
you know in the American culture is so
it's so funny um like The Comeback right
when I was when I wanted to write my
book I got turned down by multiple
publishing agencies and people like
well like you didn't come back right you
know um and I think that's like the
American like through the American scope
of how we look at things like well did
they come back and crush it and and and
that's a comeback story I'm like [ __ ] no
like I came back mentally right like
that's a story like that's that's a
story that should be cherished for
younger kids out there for older people
out there it doesn't matter you don't
have to come back and do what you did
before and do it exponentially better
you have to come back better as a person
and and and really value that process
like that's a comeback like that's that
that should be an American story so yeah
I I think my my goals are a little bit
outlandish for myself I want to own my
own media Network one day my man um
that's where so that's you know I came
out I was like hey this is like God's in
right like I you know I I have a
two-bedroom apartment in New York I you
know my mom comes and unfortunately
there's a there's a big camera in the
room and there's lights and she's like
she's like are you filming me while I
sleep and I was like no but now I may
because it may be interesting content
you know um but like I I I think about
hey how can I how can I be bigger and
better and I think about now how can I
break outside this mold of just being a
college basketball analyst that's how I
got my foot in the door TV right but I'm
infatuate with the process of TV because
as as you know it's amazing when you
have to to be vulnerable to talk about
issues that a lot of people aren't
willing to talk about on TV like there's
a there's something special about that
so if that's me having conversations
with you know somebody I'm interviewing
or me being Lost in You Know telling
dialogue I I love it like I'm it's my
passion it's my new basketball court yes
I love that man so much so my thing is
you you said something I it was in the
book um you said the reason that this
has become like the American um like
narrative for the comeback story is
because it erases the mistake and I
thought that is such a powerful Insight
that is exactly why one you would want
to come back for yourself right so then
you you can stop feeling bad about it
right cuz you're playing it in your head
head 247 right so and then the other is
it would give hope to the people
watching you that I could erase my own
mistakes
like there is a way to erase it now I've
never thought of it like that I think
it's a really powerful but the way that
I do think about it I read one time um
never let your past be bigger than your
future and like you so I built a billion
dollar business I'm familiar and now
I've started something new right how the
[ __ ] do I top that so now going back to
my obsession with your tattoo I have to
believe to be crazy enough to believe
that I can actually build something
bigger than that and that that will
ultimately be small potatoes but now I
know that when I was doing it and we
achieved it and it was more than a build
that I was like everybody else like this
really just [ __ ] happened like I
can't I'm as shocked as anybody else
right like we set out to build something
it happened so much faster like all of
it was a surprise so to now go okay well
now I've totally redefined what's
possible like dreaming at that level was
my like crazy idea oh my God like one
day like cuz my number is actually 100
million I just want to get to 100
million so when we like smashed through
got to a billion I was like freaking out
right so then it it resets you so now my
obsession is what I'll code name
terraforming okay so Elon Musk is going
to terraform Mars so he's literally
going to put a colony there they're
going to build an atmosphere on a planet
that to me is like the definition of
dreaming big right like when you're
prepared to say Okay I want to terraform
that planet
that means I have to build a rocket ship
and you know like work your way back to
all the things that he's had to do to
get to that point he's amazing even what
E's doing with the whole freeway system
yeah that's crazy go from downtown to
LAX in like 5 minutes I'm like God I'm
sorry no no please I mean that's you're
right on the money I mean that's exactly
what I'm talking about so my thing is
like seeing you now building dreams that
are bigger like and that's why I ask you
if you think of yourself as old or young
and I get what you're saying by being
old soul but at 35 I hope I can convince
you that you're a baby and that you've
got so much of your life I'm a baby
right we've got so much of our lives
left to live there so much time to learn
and grow and get better that to fail to
believe that you could do something
bigger than being drafted like that's
that would be my coping mechanism right
like I would immediately go okay cool
that's done I'm not going to look back
um but I am going to something bigger I
am going to do something better because
it one it's exciting and you have given
me the Insight that in some way that
would erase that mistake you know it's
funny too for a while and I you're dead
on with that I associate it bigger with
monetary value so for me it was like Hey
I could have made 250 million in my NBA
career how do I how do I achieve that
like that's that's the goal that's what
bigger means and bigger has changed for
me to now meaning impact right so yes I
do want to have my own media Network one
day um I do want to help other people
film content I I love content but I
rather I rather be I don't worry about
the money now the money is going to take
care of itself if I impact people the
rest will
happen me telling my story was selfish
at first because I wanted to write a
book for me I needed to write a book for
me I needed to sit down and really go
through the [ __ ] The Good The Bad and
and really write it out and I didn't
even know if I wanted to share it at
first because a lot of people when they
write a book They're not going to be
fully transparent they're going to be
worried about what is my image what is
my image I'm portraying to everybody
else is this going to hinder me from
getting other deals can I lose deals
that I currently have and writing it
after I got done I was
like was like Wow [ __ ] that feels good
it feels good and it didn't matter what
people said good or bad some reviews
killed my book other reviews loved it it
wasn't I didn't write it for them at
first and then after I started hearing
people tell me their
stories oh [ __ ] like this is this is
what it's all about you know and I used
to say it all the time why me why me why
me and all of a sudden that conversation
changed to yeah [ __ ] yeah like why not
me like why not me and I think the more
you can start looking at facing
adversity by saying why not me you
approach things with a completely
different mentality than a person who
feels like they're going to be a victim
you start becoming the hunter again and
the more you can stay with that Hunter
mentality it will pay dividends down the
L dude I love that that is thank you for
that one I will remember thank you man
are you kidding me I wish I had my
notebook I'm writing down all this stuff
mentally right now so walk me through um
do you know who Stephen Hawking is I do
okay so you want to talk about losing
your body um and he's got an amazing
quotee that really empowered me and he
said when you complain nobody wants to
help you H which I just thought okay if
he's talking about that if he's talking
about like not to be a victim and and he
in very similar ways to what you're
talking about is now you found this new
purpose you're going to be able to help
people specifically because you were in
the accident he said look I've made
these contributions to physics because I
lost my body and you know up until that
point I was sort of a lad you know went
out drinking and partying with the boys
and never really took School seriously
and it was only in these moments that I
really um
as I lost my body it forced me to really
focus on my mind and build something
incredible um and that concept to me is
is pretty breathtaking so while I don't
think things happen for a reason it's
incredibly powerful to see the wisdom
that people can mine from whatever's
happened to them if they choose if they
choose for sure I I I think choose is a
really imperative word because a lot of
people choose not choose not to you know
follow up on things that happened in
their past or sit time to reflect and
that's why I alluded to earlier it's
amazing it's like uh this hampster will
that people are just like you know I I
see it all the time I think New York
City is a is a prime target for it
because I can walk down the street and
it's you know look there's a epidemic
with homeless people in New York right I
think that's throughout our country too
and um there was a guy who lived outside
my apartment and I I have a place in
Tribeca I've worked really hard for it
and it would shatter my Soul every
morning when I would get up in my
apartment and I have these these big
windows and I look out and I see this
guy who's homeless right and um I was
sitting there one day and I saw so many
people just going by them just on their
phone not paying attention to him um not
that he was looking for attention at all
and uh I got out of my apartment I went
down and I started talking to him and
you started finding out this guy and his
story and where he's from and you know
the fact that he lost his daughter in a
really bad accident he used to work on
Wall Street
and his wife divorced him and you know
he he can't he can't pick up the pieces
and look I wanted to help the guy and
you try to talk the guy I don't think he
was all there anymore I think he had he
had succumbed to the um just the
resentment and the
the contention he had for the world in
general okay but he said something that
was so powerful to
me because in in a moment when he was
talking about all
frustrations he he said you know what
though I am where I am and only I can
change it and I I remember I remember
wow you know as much as we're talking
you are the only person that could
change it at the end of the day people
can want to help you as much as they
want to help you and I I don't think
complaining is the answer either I think
vulnerability and and and talking to
people about what's actually going on in
your life get them invested in you and
the more you listen to them get some
invested you know you invested back in
them and that's when a bond is formed
but that person can only take you so far
you have to want to take yourself to a
different place and if you don't have
that then you're going to stay stuck and
a lot of people choose to stay stuck and
we see it every single day so that that
always scares me um he's self-aware
enough to know that he is the problem
and the
solution do you have like a piece of
advice that you get did you tell him
anything like what do you say I I didn't
really know what to say at that given
moment and you know it scar I mean a lot
of people they may not properly
articulate that but they live their
lives that way I mean um I I just I
think the more you're willing to
confront it the more you're willing to
talk about it I think talking helps man
you know I know this sounds cheesy not
at all but um I talk to myself okay um
people have seen me and I think I'm a
little bit crazy but um you know I
remind myself of what happened you know
uh I wake up in the morning and I I
always make sure that I look at my leg I
have to I can't pick up my big toe right
so I have to crack my toe my curl always
cracks and it hurts in the morning when
I crack it because it gets stiff and it
just all right my accident happened like
June 19th 2003 right it happened it
sucked it was painful but it happened
it's it's a part of my blueprint it
doesn't Define me but it's a part of my
story but a lot lot of people allow that
one moment to define the rest of the
story you you can't allow that to happen
and you have to be vulnerable enough
with yourself to accept the fact that
[ __ ] happened bad stuff happens to
everybody um you have to drive your own
car and if you don't drive it somebody
else going to drive it for you and that
that other person is driving it may not
be a person it may be a darkness that
entity that we talked about that is easy
to get lost and consumed in have you
ever thought about waking up looking at
your leg cracking your pain big toe and
saying the accident happened thank God
and I am a fundamentally different human
being and I'm going to impact the lives
of countless people because I have a
mind that is capable of suffering at a
level other people are not and because I
went through the darkest of periods and
clawed my way out not that it was easy
that I clawed my way out and I know how
to help people now in a way that I never
could have UND if I didn't go through
it I I I did say thank you um probably
when I was 30 years old 5 years ago I
said thank you for happening to me I'm
still clawing now I don't think you ever
claw your way out I think it's a process
it's easy to go back into that that's
why I talk about you know reaffirming
what happened and reaffirming where you
want to go to yourself you know we spend
so much time talking to other people and
giving other people advice on what they
need to do in their life and sometimes
sometimes you need to sit down and give
yourself advice on what's what's best
for you um what's some of the best
advice you've given
yourself H wow
um can't live in the past I have to be
present I I think there are a lot of
times that you would see me in moments
where I wouldn't be there cuz I was too
busy re acccounting what was instead of
what's Happening currently not even
what's going to happen like I just
wasn't even present uh I was just there
um some other advice I think that um I
have to continue to be better I know I
know it's simple but I I still I still
have faults man I still make mistakes
I'm I'm I'm not perfect I'm not perfect
in
relationships um I I've hurt people and
I've been hurt it's a challenge for me
to really let somebody in to you know my
own demons uh that I suffer
from it's a challenge for me in my
relationship with my father
um I love my dad wholeheartedly me
writing the book hurt our relationship
to a
degree I try to talk to him about it
it's a work in progress It's amazing how
some of the people that you love more
than anything you have a difficult time
connecting to but you feel the love you
recognize it so I think there's still so
many aspects of me where there's room
for improvement and there's room for
growth and like you know people say I
can't believe you got yourself out I'm
like I'm still getting myself out of it
and it's never going to stop and that's
a good thing because it could have
stopped on June 19th and if it had
stopped on June 19th 2003 how sad would
that have been that I would even have
been able to spend time reflecting on
the [ __ ] that I was doing so now it's
like I have a I have a second chance and
I'm not going to say that I sometimes
don't get carried away or get lost in
what I'm doing I'm I am extremely
ambitious right just like you right so
you know if that's work I I look some my
girlfriend needs to check me my mom
needs to check me I have these people
who are sounding boards in my life right
now who are willing to say difficult
things to me and I I ask you how many
people do you have that you have allowed
to be in your circle that can say
painful things to you that you may not
like to hear and then once you hear them
are you willing to accept it right um
I've been lucky enough to have people in
my life like that and I make sure I try
to stay surrounded with those people
that is wise yeah your whole concept of
having a board of people that really
have your best interest at heart and and
I think that's my wife and I talk a lot
about that that notion of okay I'm
hearing something I don't want to hear
this really hurts and from a random
person this may even lead to like me
shutting down not wanting to hear it but
because I can ask the question does this
person love me with yes and answer it
with yes then you've got a shot to
really lower your defenses and hear it
and adopt it and that's really really
important and it's it's rewarding it's
fulfilling it's fulfilling to to
recognize that nobody is the perfect in
product and that everybody has stuff to
work on but once you're able to say wow
that that is something I need to work on
and you you feel yourself taking the
steps necessary to be better at it what
advice do you have for people that are
going through like real anguish like
real pain I guess either emotional or
physical um what makes me ask this is
I'm so curious to know what your
internal talk was like during the early
days of physical therapy when it was
just just grueling H um I I think the
first thing is to and I I I I do this
when I do talks and it's amazing to see
how squirmish and uncomfortable people
get you hear that that's only person
you're dealing with is you when you're
quiet it's fascinating it's fascinating
to look inside yourself or to spend time
with yourself and whenever I do a talk
or when I talk to people who I think are
going through a lot of pain I first tell
them okay I understand what you're going
through but you just need to stop for
one second because what we have a
tendency to do is we over inate oursel
with other things that really don't
matter to keep ourselves busy to keep
not thinking about the things that do
matter so once you're finally able to
stop yourself and you're present with
yourself you have to go back and you
have to address it I'm not saying that
you're going to find a conclusion right
then and there but you have to recognize
that whatever happened did happen
and I try to push people to find silver
linings I I think there's truly a silver
lining in everything and once again it's
what you choose to focus your energy on
if you choose to focus your energy on
all the things that God took away from
you or whatever entity that is that you
believe in took away from you then you
will be consumed with that energy if you
try to force yourself to be consumed
with the Silver Lining even if you
revert back you have to remind yourself
of the silver lining
because it gives you a Target goal like
you know it it's mental targeting are
you able to focus on something that
allows you to get out of your own way if
you don't have a goal to help you get
out of your own way you will be stuck so
what is that is that your wife is that
your parents whatever you need to use to
be better for you have to do that and
you have to find that that's only going
to come from listening to yourself and
spending time with yourself I love that
all right before I ask ask you my last
question where can these guys find you
online uh hopefully everywhere I'm
trying to be everywhere uh try to
lighten up the conversation a little bit
uh uh I I do stuff all over I mean
social media between Twitter Instagram
and and Facebook and um I'm trying all
these different new shows you know I'm
trying to pitch a show called uh Fu
money because I'm fascinated to hear
what people's numbers are you know
everybody has a number which they feel
like they can you know accomplish
something and it's amazing sitting down
and talking to people some people's
numbers are 2 million some people's
numbers are 500 million and some
people's numbers are 20,000 right and
it's not about the money at all so you
know doing stuff like that um I'm dying
to break out and being involved in
entertainment do more sit down talks
with people and I think there's this
beautiful collision between culture
Sports and politics right now and it
it's so fasinating to watch um different
people decide to step up out of their
particular silo and speak out out about
other issues that aren't the ones that
they work in right and how you respond
to that like you know people saying to
me if I make a comment about where we
need to be politically and I'm not
saying that I'm for Trump or I'm against
Trump I don't agree with a lot of stuff
Trump's doing right now but he is our
commander in tweets I mean our
commander-in-chief um you got that um so
like my I did a little series called
reunited States of America where it was
fascinating for me to do a social
experience
and to see if people are willing to
listen to what other people have to
think so I sat down with a gay couple um
there were two Caucasian males who were
Republicans right which is almost um
yeah it's it's oxy [ __ ] within itself
right to a certain degree and they
talked a little bit about the history
and about you know things that happened
to their in their family and and why
they voted for Trump and but I didn't I
think all these people that I sat down
with expected me to um kind of retort
and and have somewhat of a contentious
dialogue and I just sat there and I
listened and then I let that stuff play
across all my different social media
channels and it hey everything starts
with a conversation and if you're not
willing to hear the other side and
understand where the other side is
coming from you can still disagree on a
multitude of issues but you don't
understand what that person has gone
through that helps them see the world
the way they decide to see the world but
once you understand that then you can
find common ground for a conversation so
um trying to do things that spark those
kind of thoughts intellectually
stimulate people instead of just do
crazy things for views I I like this I
don't think this happens enough well
that leads very beautifully into my last
question which is what is the impact
that you want to have on the world I
just want to be the best version of me I
don't know if that's ever going to
happen but
I want to I hope that I can help other
people get out of their own
way and
um I I do believe that the series of
events that happened in my life happen
for a
reason and I've chose to listen to those
reasons and kind of follow through on
those things that I felt like I needed
to work on and just let people know that
this if you're lucky if we're lucky
you're always going to be a work in
progress
and you have to want to
work you have to be willing to put in
the time and the effort and it's funny
CU you said something I really pride
myself on that I thought I did as a as a
basketball player um I did always stay
in the gym and I was the guy to always
try to get up more shots than you um you
know after Kobe said that I took my ass
back to the gym and worked out
more but you you never get better if
you're not willing to put in the time
and basketball is very similar to the
game of life there's going to be ups and
downs sometimes you may turn the ball
over seven times in a row but if you put
into the work and you constantly put in
the
work you can't allow that one mistake to
go into the next play I love that idea
you if you allow seven turnovers to go
into my next possession with the
basketball or that next possession in
life if you allow that divorce or if you
allow that passing away of somebody or
that loss of a career to go into the
next eight plays you'll have another
eight turnovers you have to be willing
to say that was back there that happened
but it doesn't mean it needs to happen
now and the more I can help people
understand that they're lucky to even be
in a position to have a chance to
reinvent or to re address things from
their past it doesn't matter you know
somebody that Did You Wrong say
something to them man your time you have
on this Earth is short and I lose side
of that too um doing talks like this
they help me um you should always look
for help and that's why I like to
surround myself with those type of
people cuz they always help you get out
your own way I love that Brother Jay
thank you so much for coming on the show
man that was amazing you're awesome dude
thank you guys all right I'm going to
crawl through the camera in a minute I'm
telling you you've got to read this book
life is not an accident it is amazing
the way that he walks you through what
happened one again like I said in the
beginning it's just well written so if
you like good books you will love this
book but the important part about it is
the story that he tells which to me is
the ultimate one of the most beautiful
and empowering stories of redemption why
because the thing that from the moment
you hear about his accident that you
will be praying for is for him to get
back in the NBA he doesn't he totally
takes that away that's not this story
and the reason that I think that is so
important is watching him rebuild
another life watch him totally transform
and reinvent himself and have to claw
literally out of the pitch black
darkness that is depression and to be
able to claw his way out of that by
building a future for himself by saying
that's over that's done I'm willing to
shut the door on that because remember
that's where most people get paralyzed
they walk into a room with a thousand
doors and they're unwilling to shut any
of them so they can't go but now imagine
an even more terrifying one where you
went through the door that made you feel
most alive you were ecstatic you
couldn't believe it you go through and
then it's shut in your face and what do
you do with that and the fact that this
man was able to go through physical
torture literally read the book and you
will see when I say torture I'm not
kidding to go through physical torture
only to then have to go through the
mental torture Which is far more
difficult to build a compelling future
for himself and to be willing to apply
all the things that made him great
before the willingness to outwork the
willingness to get out of his own way to
self assess to finally figure out the
lesson about who you surround yourself
with to grind it out to learn from
mentors like coach Kay who we didn't
even get a chance to talk about you're
going to hear about all that stuff in
the book and I promise you all the
things that made him great had nothing
to do with basketball and everything to
do with his mind so I am eternally
grateful for you coming on the show
thank you I cannot thank you enough guys
dig in this is a weekly show so if you
haven't already be sure to subscribe
please check this man out you will not
regret it and until next time my friends
be legendary Take
Care thank you for impact thank you
sir hey everybody thanks so much for
joining us for another episode of impact
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