Kind: captions
Language: en
hey everybody welcome to another episode
of after impact today we are going hard
on that Jamie wheel cake uh I had so
much fun shooting this episode and I
know that agent Smith here is going to
be uh doing what he does taking this in
a whole new Direction by the way I hope
you've seen you've been getting like mad
love in the comments people love what
you doing with the show so well thank
you thank you all right Jamie wheel that
was an awesome episode really was I I
enjoyed a lot and uh he's one of those
guests that uh is multidisciplinary so
he talked about everything from brain
chemistry he was quoting Yates which I
really loved and uh all the way to
current affairs and what's happening and
and how people can uh make an impact on
on their on the world today so wide
ranging love episodes like that um I
guess my first question is cuz I I'm I'm
getting the sense that probably some
people don't know who Jamie will is or
what he's about and of his content and
what he's talking about is is a little
heady so why should people know who Jam
will is one and what should people take
away from that episode that's a great
question so Jamie wheel um just uh at a
high level he is the executive director
of the flow Genome Project which is
something that he co-founded uh with um
stepen Cotler who's the author behind he
co-authored bold and abundance with
Peter diamandis um and then he wrote by
himself a book called the rise of
Superman which is probably the thing
that made him most famous but he's
written a couple of other books um and
the rise of Superman was really powerful
and really introduced people to this
concept of flow which people had heard
about in maybe to a less um academic uh
way in thinking about sports and the
zone and this rise of Superman really
showed that there's something a lot more
going on that you see it a lot in
extreme athletes and the book sort of
sums up by saying like there's so much
more research to do in terms of how to
get into flow much more easily what flow
actually is like if you could map that
brain State what would that look like
and that's why it was called the flow
Genome Project they were really trying
to map it out what it looked like and so
Jamie wheel was the man that Steven
Cotler turned to to actually create that
organization and um really reverse
engineer the states what they are what
they look like what the patterns are um
identify whether flow is different than
psychedelic States different than
meditative States and you know where the
synergies the Crossovers and all that
and so they did a lot of research and
went out and um worked with you know
some really big clients and and that's
really where Jamie shines and um his
background is is very eclectic and um
his father was British and a test pilot
and was basically the Brits version of a
Top Gun um test pilot instructor and
then his mom was like Old School South
African uh he said she was Merchant
Ivory old scho school so like really
regimented but then he grew up from like
the age of I don't know 12 or 13 grew up
here in the states so always felt a
little bit Like a Stranger in a Strange
Land which gave him a really unique
window into the world interesting so
what do you think to put this episode in
context because it's so wide ranging
what do you think people should take
away maybe they haven't watched it yet
or maybe they've watched it and they're
trying to digest all the inform all that
information what do you think is the
main takeway from this the main gist is
that there exists a thing that they call
non-ordinary States Of Consciousness and
it's interesting because it just came up
so we just filmed an episode with Chase
Jarvis if you guys know who that is
amazing I really liked him like he is
there something people call him affable
a lot and I think that's super super uh
apt description he just welcomes you in
and there's something inate to him about
wanting to create and help people and we
were talking about how he had come to
these major epiphanies in his life that
led him to be one of the most revered
photographers ever certainly of our time
and and he said it really was he didn't
use the word non-ordinary States Of
Consciousness but that's what he was
saying right these big life things
happen they slap you out of your
ordinary way of thinking and then you're
able to see things more clearly and
that's really what jaim is dedicated his
life to and that's what I think is the
main thrust of the episode is um there
are uh what they break down into three
camps of non-ordinary states of
Consciousness which are um flow
meditative and mystical and psychedelic
and those are like the what he calls the
door
that lead to this given destination
which is um a profound non-ordinary
State of Consciousness where you're able
to see things AR fresh and easis right
ecstasis yeah which is an ancient Greek
word which they use because basically
ecstasy which ecstasy actually does the
job from a pure definition standpoint
which is the ability to Step Beyond
yourself um but it's been so co-opted by
like drug culture that they knew okay we
we can't say ecstasy because people just
think of the drug um so how do we get to
this concept of stepping Beyond yourself
and ecstasis uh from ancient Greek is
where they ended up and so just you know
the the different ways to get to um to
that ecstasis to Step Beyond oneself and
dissolve the ego and see things new
awesome I want to throw a quote out
there from the episode So Jamie says
we're drowning in information but
starving for motivation what do you
think that means you know it's
interesting especially given um some of
the debate from Mel um Mel Robbins who
if guys haven't seen that episode went
totally viral and uh her Facebook clip
has had like 11 million views at last
count and the the thumbnail of that is
motivation is garbage and I think people
really like people want to argue rather
than be enlightened and that's one of
those things that like it's such a
counterproductive strategy so looking
beyond the words motivation is garbage
to what she's really saying I think um
is purely
that being prepared to actually Act is
going to be the problem that's always
where people fall down right so you
might have like you might feel raw RW
one moment but then you get cold or
you're tired or whatever and then
motivation leaves you and it's not there
when you need it and so she was talking
about having these um other things to
you know to to be there for you so
um that I think is he's talking about
the the actual willingness to act but
read me his exact quote again we're
drowning in information but starving for
motivation so that same thing right that
that you you know what you should be
doing but when the moment comes you just
don't you don't move and so I those two
I think are saying the same thing I
think it's really a hot button thing for
people um somebody else said it I I
can't remember now who but it was like
if information was the problem then we'd
all be rich and have six-pack abs and
that's actually true and that's why my
obsession is execution right people need
to focus on execution like you need to
do things right and when you talk to the
highest level Achievers in the world
they're all going to point to that that
they do right and one thing that I'm
trying to really put words around and I
think that Jim's quote sort of hints at
here is there's this breakdown in the
moment where you allow yourself to dream
big which most people even their biggest
dream is small but let's say you really
allow yourself to dream big and then you
start trying to execute against that
you're going to feel dumb clumsy
incapable incompetent the voice inside
your head is going to tell you that you
are all those things you're never going
to achieve because there's this
awkwardness whenever you're learning a
new skill and it really is like when I
try to reverse engineer the success that
I've had it's the willingness to to one
accept that that's a natural part of the
process that the in the voice in my head
will tell me I'm not going to be able to
do this you're not going to be capable
you're going to fall you're going to
fail you're going to embarrass yourself
you're going to wish you'd never started
and that if I push through that and I
keep doing it long enough it will start
at first to feel um doable and then it
will feel easy and then it will be I'll
truly be graceful at it um and then it
will feel like truly secondhand um
second nature excuse me so that's you
know just understanding that that's the
process and being willing to fight
through that that deep discomfort to get
there um and and I think that's you know
essentially what Jamie is trying to
capture with that quote Yeah I glass
calls that the taste Gap so it's
identifying the thing that you want to
be or become or be able to do that is so
um so far beyond your skills right now
and most people can't get Beyond The
Taste Gap because it's so intimidating
why does you call it a taste Gap um it's
something to do with his notion of that
that um we all start with like having
tastes and saying that I like this or I
want this and that is sort of what
guides us toward the passion that we
have or what we want to start developing
in skills but a lot of people fall down
in the taste cap because you can't they
can't cross it I'm with him on that um
all right I want to give a quick shout
out to Emanuel Padilla who has joined
the live stream through a share from
Dennis J Santiago thanks to both of you
yeah
Dennis is trying to bring Emanuel into
the fold here back one of us one of us
awesome so um we have a question here
from the feed from Dan bro Fitness Dan
bro in the house what's up dude always a
pleasure to have you and this is a
really practical question I find it
incredibly hard to get into flow I get
distracted and lose focus very easy what
are your tips to dive deep into flow so
there's really two one you're probably
an environment rich rich with
distraction and so that's going to be
the first thing to get yourself into a
state like if I need to write I'm going
to try to shut out the world as much as
possible I don't want visual
distractions I don't want auditory
distractions so I'm going to go in a
room ideally by myself sometimes in a
dark room um I'm going to put headphones
on over ear and I'm going to play
something like either film scores which
have no words or uh white noise and a
lot of times what I choose is like the
sound of a a meadow or rain or you know
something where what I find interesting
is is doing natural sounds instead of
just like a a you know a a fan or
something like true White Noise which I
do that when I sleep uh but when I'm
writing or something I like more natural
sounds cuz it it it makes my mind feel
expansive because the auditory world
that's being painted for me is expansive
it's fascinating I never would have
thought that that'd be a thing but
that's the thing um for me anyway and
then the other is stakes and I find that
if there aren't Stakes involved and I
don't mean the edible kind I mean like
there's something at risk there's
something like I do my best work when I
know that I'm running out of time to
prepare for the episode and that's when
it's like okay I really click over but
then if you get too close to the end and
I'm like really behind and I start
feeling stressed then I slip back out so
there's like this um fine uh Zone where
I'm close enough to being at a time that
I'm really focused I'm sharp I'm in it
I'm going going going
um but I'm not so close and so far
behind that I start to feel like really
stressed out so you've got to you know
figure out a way to put some Stakes to
it um whether it's giving yourself a
limited amount of time or you know I
mean this is not a great one but um the
extreme athletes are known for this that
one of the reasons that they're so able
to get into flow and that they're you
know flow junkies is because a mess up
in an extreme Athletics can mean death
or or certainly permanent injury so the
are so elevated that they really have to
focus and it It ultimately it's that
focus and you're dealing with something
where your skill set is stretched but
adequate to the task so if your skill
set isn't pushed enough if it's not like
woo this is right at the edge of what
I'm capable of then it just it doesn't
demand enough of your attention to do it
and if it's too hard then it's um you're
getting negative feedback because you're
not able to actually do it and that can
pull you out of flow so it's got to be
right there in that sweet spot um but it
takes practice but I think the thing
that that it's focus and Stakes those
are the two big ones yeah the extreme
sports one is interesting and that's
what the rise of Superman is all about
right yeah and you've read the book
obviously um have you ever utilized that
channel the sports no no extreme sports
yeah no no no no no or anything even
close to
that um Live Events like if I have to
give a talk okay there's sort of social
consequence so if you let me count that
then yes but um God I'm trying to think
like I don't really I don't do things
that are truly dangerous um my desire
for something would have to be so strong
for me to put myself in a truly
dangerous situation um so I'm not an
adrenaline junkie I've never jumped out
of a plane I went skiing once I hated it
um it's actually a lie I went skiing
twice hated it both times if that counts
for anything poor father he so tried to
get me to do cool like men stuff and I
was just a total wuss all right uh we
will jump into the next question here so
um Jamie talks about how the food
industry has you know figured out the
equation for getting people super
addicted to food buddy um and and really
that's in a larger segment all about
brain chemistry manipulation and and all
of the uh the external stimulators that
do that so food pornography $ trillion
doll industry wanted to get your
thoughts on that especially in the
context of having run and started a food
company yourself yeah yeah so I mean
let's you know Jump Right In that that
was the premise behind Quest was food
has this tremendous brain chemistry
impact on people and that's what you're
up against so our whole thing was don't
try to change Behavior try to leverage
it so I know that people eat for
pleasure not for sustenance I know that
they are actively trying to manipulate
their brain chemistry and I will tell
you right now so my life is so um
clean for lack of a better word like I
don't cheat on my diet I don't do drugs
um I don't drink very often so it's like
how do I keep how do I get the same
excitement that everybody else gets from
messing with my brain chemistry cuz
humans animals like to mess with their
brain chemistry they just love it and
you can go on YouTube right now and
search for like moose getting drunk and
you'll see them like eating fermented
grapes or fermented apples and it's like
they get drunk and they stumble around
like animals just want to do that and it
it is because the reward system in our
brain is neurochemistry and that's what
makes sex exciting food exciting all
that stuff right so if you can grab a
hold of those levers like you're going
to do it and dude I'm going to get way
on a tangent here so you're going to
have to reel us back in in a minute but
let me fly into the wind for a second
they've done some incredibly interesting
studies where you give a rat like even a
rat that's just recently had a pup and
and you can um you give it two levers
One releases food and the other um
triggers because you can do this with
cocaine or just with a direct stimulant
to the dopamine um centers of the brain
so that they get the the same thing and
it will sit there and press the Coke or
the dopamine releaser until it dies
it'll let its pup starve to death it'll
let itself starve to death because it is
so pleasurable to mess with those levers
like once you give people those levers
dude oh it's just bad news but now scary
if you really you want to get really
interesting yeah all right let's get
really interesting for a second it no
longer holds true if you put them in a
rich environment where there's all kinds
of cool stuff to do wow so imagine for a
second that I put you um in the world as
it is today and you've got a career and
there's things you can chase and you've
got Yates and you can read about Yates
write about Yates I mean sounds oddly
similar to the world I am in today
exactly which is why you're not a
cokehead yeah uh or I then put you and I
give you Coke in this world right so
like let's say right now there's a vial
of coke you wouldn't take it I don't
think right and you could afford Coke so
yeah you're not going to start doing
coke and stuff um but if I put you in
solitary confinement for a month two
months and there was a violet Coke
sitting next to you you might be like
what else is there to do exactly and so
that's where it gets really fascinating
is when a rat is in an environment where
it's got all these other options they
don't turn to the drugs like nearly as I
mean I don't know the exact St but it
was if I remember right it was dramatic
so that's something to take into
consideration with all this stuff it's
we're all the other things that you do
are also to manipulate your brain
chemistry right so writing reading
movies like all of those things love
manipulates your brain chemistry like
you can measure like if you let me hug
my wife or even um smell oh God the side
of her neck in the morning cuz she
hasn't had a shower yet smells like her
like as I identify her I promise you
there are like neurochemical fireworks
going off in my brain because like that
scent is so soothing and Powerful to me
so all it's brain chemistry like we just
want to manipulate that stuff all right
um I don't remember the initial question
so I have no concept whether I answered
it or not we were talking about brain
chemistry manipulation and food and
pornography and yeah oh so I started at
Quest so yeah that was we understood
that we had to leverage that behavior we
wanted to use all of people's impulses
to eat cookies cakes candy pie and say
we're going to make that cookies cakes
candy pie actually good for you uh but
that's why all of the flavors were like
um strawberry cheesecake and chocolate
chip cookie dough it was like we wanted
it to taste like and we wanted you
thinking about all those foods that got
you in trouble and then we wanted to
make them healthy for you so I used to
say look the food in I don't think the
food industry is Sinister I think that
they just made small incremental steps
along the path to giving you something
that was really amazing I mean think
about it back in the day like if you
were you know Nabisco chips aoy which I
think it's the same company anybody
making like junk food right you were
probably giving it to your own kids and
your own grandkids cuz it makes them
happy right you were eating some of it
it tastes good it makes you happy so I
don't think it was they didn't have ill
intent it just is like this slippery
slope of when when you are just trying
to manipulate people's brain chemistry
through the food with total disregard
for what the long-term Health
consequences are then you get yourself
into a dicey situation but as Quest we
were actually grateful that somebody had
done all of that science so we were able
to take the science of taste marry it to
good nutrition and create products that
were you know getting people we had so
many people thousands of people right in
with these dramatic Transformations so
there's a winning formula to be had it's
just consumers have to push companies to
go farther companies have to push
themselves to go farther and you know on
the other side of that with the right
set of core values you can do amazing
things and that's really what this
episode is about it's about identifying
all of the uh uh things that are
manipulating us all the addictions that
are external to us that we're not aware
of becoming aware of them and then
figuring out which levers to pull to
actually manipulate them in your own
benefit and one of those levers that you
talk about extensively in the episode is
drugs so we have a question from uh
Roman from YouTube actually he said yes
did this Tom did this show change your
view on psychedelic drugs and if yes are
you now open to the possibility of
taking psychedelics one day yeah I mean
he's thank you Roman for couching all
that language and really making it soft
um I'm intrigued I'm intrigued but I'm
really just uh I'm
super
scared and part of it is like if I
really reflect I like the self-narrative
of I'm the guy that doesn't do drugs
like I like that I like being able to
say that and I don't like the thought of
not being able I don't want to be like I
don't do drugs except psilocybin MDMA
you know what I mean it just I don't
know that doesn't sound cool to me um
and that's a huge driver I mean that's
just full disclosure so um not doing
drugs is an important part of my
self-narrative but at the same time I'm
a learner and I don't get dogmatic and
so I I'm the guy that can break free of
things like that so you know talking to
Jamie was very very intriguing I got the
chance to talk to him a lot off camera
and really sort of understand what his
um um his motives are pure with that
like he really just wants people to um
experience the the the Transcendent and
he means that very literally that you
know to um to really get perspective on
something you always have to step
outside yourself so uh a baby goes
through the terrible twos because they
um they aren't yet fully aware that
there's them and there's somebody else
right somebody else to think about and
develop theory of mind and understand
how your actions impact them and all
that and as we develop you know we
really begin to develop empathy and the
ability to project and then yeah he has
this really eloquent like stair step
that leads ultimately to um you know
there is only me when I can Define
myself as not you there is only us when
we can Define ourselves as not them
there is only the us when we are not you
know whatever another country and and he
says for us to really overcome the
division that is so present here in the
US
and between nations is to get a
cosmological perspective as he calls it
and to step outside and he says
astronauts get it because they see the
Earth at a distance and the pale blue
dot effect where it's just so obvious
that fighting over imaginary lines um
when you're like this infinitesimally
small thing on this tiny planet Lost in
You know just floating in space like it
just doesn't make sense the absurdity of
it all comes crashing down on you and so
he says not everyone can be an astronaut
at least not yet give uh you know Elon
Musk Jeff Bezos and Richard Branson
enough time and I think that it will uh
become a thing but it's not a thing yet
so to get that cosmological perspective
he said you know you really have a few
options you've got flow states which can
help you've got meditative and mystical
states which can help you've got
near-death experiences which he had some
really interesting comments about how um
what is you know this incredibly
traumatic event where people literally
almost die and but they come back
feeling a communion with everyone they
feel more connected more alive that
there's more Beauty in their life and it
becomes this incredibly profound moment
for them what do you think's behind that
it it it is this thing that he's talking
about that that yeah that cosmological
or where the last one which is a
psychedelic experience and I think that
a near-death experience if I had to
guess I haven't had one nor have I had a
psychedelic experience so I'm I'm coming
at this purely from an academic angle
but from the descriptions they sound
very very similar so there's clearly
something going on with the um
neurochemical flood that hits your brain
during a near-death experience during a
psychedelic experience where there's
immediate and profound transformation of
wiring and it seems to help most
profoundly with traumatic stuff so a lot
of the research being done around
um uh PTSD uh War veterans that seem to
really respond and very very rapidly
from cycles of psilocybin and MDMA uh
which is really really fascinating and I
think and now I'm way out over um my
head and this is where I have to remind
people that I'm not a neuroscientist
even though I play one on YouTube
essentially right um but that what
you're doing is um you know really
grabbing hold of that neurochemistry
marrying it to the malleability of
memories so in a chemical state where
you don't trigger
the parasympathetic nervous system or
sorry the sympathetic nervous system
which is fight ORF flight you're not
triggering that because you have this
massive release of serotone in um and
oxytocin there's like a few other ones
that Jamie mentions I don't remember the
exact cocktail um but the things that
make you feel really really good in that
moment you extract your memory and the
way memories work when you pull it out
of stored memory it now becomes
malleable and you can change it and just
by revisiting it in that chemical state
where you can't feel agit ated angry
upset in fact you feel really good about
it you paint that memory with that
neurochemistry so you're like wait a
second this thing that was totally
traumatic for me that was controlling my
life and making me feel incredibly
anxious now as I think about it it's
wrapped in a feeling of connection and
beauty and calm and so now when I put
that memory back it either gets stored
as neutral it's just robbed of its
negative power or I it has this
Transcendent quality of recognizing
empathy for the abuser or recognizing
empathy for the you know the situation
of war or whatever the case may be that
it now it's not that you're like oh my
God I loved it but it has a neutral to
um cosmological perspective and I think
if if it's able to that profoundly touch
enough of those memories cuz memories
come in like all these little pieces so
if enough of them are are pulled out
washed with that and then put back it
seems to from the studies it seems to
have a profound effect and Lasting by
the way yeah and he also talked about
you know it's it's a question of you
know deciding which Doorway to go
through is a question of how risk averse
you are how much time you have how much
money you have and one of the things
that constantly comes up on our show is
meditation and something you and Jamie
talked about a lot so talk about
meditation obviously spoken in depth
about how important it is you but as
just a thing that people can get started
with immediately I mean something you
can do right now if you want to yeah so
my experience with meditation is very
much that it is
um it's very rudimentary compared to a
near-death experience or what I hear in
people's description of a psychedelic
state so um now when you talk to people
who been meditating for 30 years they
can actually get into a gamma wave state
which is um known as the Eureka moment
as Jamie calls it in the episode and we
just lost our beautiful logo behind us
uh and with nobody here to to rescue us
see do so that is
um somebody better and more um
experienced with meditation would have
to say like whether they've been able to
get to that gamma state but if you can
really get to that gamma State through
meditation it it should be really really
quite powerful um I'm not using it for
that like I'm not I don't get to a place
where I feel at one with the world or
anything like that I'm literally just
calming my own own nervous system and so
I'm able to think clearly the background
radiation drops to zero but I would not
say that I walk away with some profound
perspective I have heard people describe
it like that like even today Chase um
Jarvis was talking a little bit more
like that um and I just that hasn't yet
been my experience give me another you
know 20 years and maybe all right we'll
check back in yeah please uh one of the
things that came up for me in this
episode when you're talking so much
about the brain I mean I've learned a
lot about the brain through watching
this show but it's still kind of fuzzy
for me and I haven't really um jumped in
and done done the serious study and so I
have this question but someone else in
the comments also has a similar question
and it's really the first thing is like
what are what are the starter books you
recommend to start learning about the
brain yeah um what are some of the basic
concepts that you need to understand or
who are some of the people who um we
should follow and and check out their
content to learn more all right so um
you're going to want David Eagleman who
wrote incognito and he gave an amazing
Ted Talk uh we're actually we don't have
a date for him yet but he's agreed to
come on the show so that would be
amazing uh really and I I've had the
very good fortune of spending an entire
evening with him um not too long ago and
just oh my God this guy he's so
passionate about the brain like talking
to him is so infectious even if you
never had an interest in the Brain
before that like he's just one of those
guys and some of the stuff that he's
working on with um he has a vest and he
could say um take a an infrared camera
and put it on your shoulder and then the
vest would create a signature that would
press against you in a given pattern
based on the signatures that you see so
I could blindfold you and you'd be able
to say oh that was Bonsai that just
walked by oh that was Lisa based on
their heat signature because you would
just over time it would take time but
over time you would recognize oh that
was wook that was Bonsai that was Lisa
oh that's Tom Casey you know what I mean
like you'd really begin to recognize
each individual person's Heat Signature
um and and they've done this with people
where they can recognize blind people
can recognize faces through like
patterns on their tongue or their back
really really fascinating so David
Eagleman is one um vs ramach chandron is
another like and he's been on the show
so watch his episode really really
fascinating and I've learned more about
the brain from vs ramach chandron than
anyone else um and people have asked me
to spell things so I know people don't
know what I'm saying I don't know how to
spell ramachandran I literally would
have to write it down I think I know how
r a m a c a h a n d r a n I think you're
right on the money so there it is
everybody to type it out a couple times
very very impressive and uh it's V as in
Victor s is in Sam so vs ramach chandron
I forget what the V and the S actually
stand for um and can I say that one of
the great joys of my life was when he
asked me to call him Rama that's yeah
that's awesome I was a cool nickname too
A and B like as a total Fanboy like when
he was like oh call me Rama it was
something like my friends call me Rama I
was like yes please you're like is that
include
me so yeah that was awesome those those
guys will smash it um Moran surf if you
guys haven't seen his episode I think
he's um just one of the the most
entertaining people when it comes to the
mind so he's an amazing doorway every
word out of his mouth is just fun and
entertaining and he's so good um at what
he's doing but he hasn't that I have
read anyway sort of primers so whereas
um vs ramachandran and um David Eagleman
like they'll get you started and this is
on my book list guys so if you go to
impact theory.com um and I think
it's- reading Das listreading list
reading Dash list um and you can see it
it's in the header now so easy access oh
nice updated there it is all right great
question here from Chris Berry uh on
Facebook live by the way I know Chris
Berry Chris Berry is a machine like this
kid like he's a beast a he works really
really hard uh B like he he was in like
back in the day was it oh God he should
put in the comics he was in like Madden
or some one of the like main NFL 2K or
something not NFL because he played at
college but whatever the college version
of these games was and he had like a
pretty beasty rating not in the game
he's in the game he's one of the
characters cuz he played uh Collegiate
Collegiate football that's that's pretty
legit that's awesome yeah no he's not if
if you met him you'd be like oh yeah
you're you're a wall of the human being
I get how you were uh playing at that
level yeah uh this question is from
Chris Berry with all the Adventure
athletes and drugs and Elite Warriors
mentioned in the discussion it seems
like a masculine thing what is a more
feminine expression of getting into flow
wow a good question that's a great
question uh so interesting because Chase
Jarvis on the show today said I think
what the world needs right now is more
feminine energy which is pretty
fascinating and we're making a big play
into Lisa is about to do her own podcast
uh the team here is obsessed with
getting amazing amazing female uh people
on female people women onto the show
also known as true uh women onto the
show we've got some cool episodes we've
already shot that are coming out uh so
what's a more female uh I am not the
right person to answer that I would I
would give you a bunch of BS I wish that
there were a woman with us right now
that could really answer that question I
don't have the Insight that you're
looking for but that question is amazing
you'll have to ask it with the next
guest who comes on you can answer that
appropriately yeah most definitely uh he
said NCAA 2004 there it is there it is
my
man okay um let's talk about okay so one
thing actually let's take let's let's
take a pause and say we're on Facebook
live doing after impact we're talking
about the episode with Jamie wheel that
aired on Tuesday um it's outstanding
we're going deep into it ask your
questions here if you've seen it if you
haven't haven't seen it go check it out
on YouTube or the podcast impact Theory
yeah and if you want to know what my
brain looks like turned inside out that
I had so much fun with this episode I
really really enjoyed being on set and
what I liked about it was I wasn't
trying to think of the next question
like I was just having a conversation
with them and I know that I get that
comment a lot where people are saying oh
my gosh like you're just having a
conversation but like half of my brain
is allocated towards like okay where do
we take this and it's very int
but with Jamie man I was just I'm so
intrigued by how his mind works um I was
having a ball yeah it was a great
episode so if you're watching this um we
are giving away an impact Theory T-shirt
If you share the live feed and also I'd
like to give another t-shirt away and
just have a kind of a survey question
for the audience here I want to know
what your favorite piece of content is
so let's let's set impact Theory the
show aside since that's kind of our main
show but all the other pieces we're
doing we're doing impact quotes books
book reviews uh after impact uh what am
I missing startup Theory the new one
drop it in the comments we want to hear
from you yeah that really really helps
us we've recently made a change in fact
on um both our book review and impact
quotes uh so be eager to see if you guys
like the changes or not definitely also
don't forget about red pill Theory yeah
which uh is going to be rebranded so
we're working now with um our our mates
I don't know what other word to say it
at Vayner Talent dude so so stoked to be
working with those guys are absolutely
incredible just got off the phone with
him right before coming on here uh so
that's under a Rebrand can't wait to
relaunch it won't tell you the name now
U you guys will see when we relaunch
that's right stay tuned all right so
this episode not only goes deep into
brain chemistry but then gets very
profound especially at the end so if
you're watching this and you watched the
first part of the episode but didn't
wait till the end you need to watch the
end of the episod watch the end watch
the end it's so good and Jamie really
starts to put things into context about
why it's so important that we are having
these profound Altered States Of
Consciousness to get perspective on our
lives and get perspective on the world
um I want to read a quote so he says we
have the ability through ecstasis to
Step Beyond ourselves to have these
experiences that expand our perspective
to have these experiences where we just
get out of our own way and we see man we
are connected to each other we see that
love beauty truth are worth taking
stances
for yeah just let that let that sink in
for a second that's a great quote and he
gave me the chills when you know we were
on set and talking and at one point I
don't remember if if that was it but at
one point he he got like quite emotional
and I remember during the interview I'm
like is is he getting emotional like I
wasn't I honestly wasn't sure and now
knowing cuz afterwards he was like wo
like I was totally taken by surprise by
that I thought damn it I should have
asked like what is it about this that's
making you so like so raw and I think
for him
it's really believing that the stuff
that he's studying could actually have
an impact on bringing people together
and his like one of his life's mission
is to bring people back together and
that he sees the division the
ideological division that's growing in
society is just totally a it's fake
right so all the things you think that
are pulling you inart just none of it's
really real and that if you can step
outside of yourself ecstasis get that
moment where you transcend your own ego
then all of that other unity and things
like becomes
self-evident and I don't know especially
I think maybe as a parent for him it was
pretty powerful to think like that that
world is just close enough to being in
our grasp um and that it's worth
fighting for yeah and what he says also
is that today there's an acceleration of
mythologies crashing into one another
and I wanted to get your thought on that
since you're a big believer in mythology
like do you see that happening today
yeah I in a in a terrifying way
and so I think you have two problems I
think you have mythology is losing its
Steam and you
have ideology colliding and that maybe
is is scarier for a couple reasons
there's usually like some pretty
profound life lessons that are contained
in myth and when you understand the
narrative you understand the story and
you believe in the story then things get
you can really encapsulate some
incredibly powerful ideas when things
break down and they become pure ideology
it becomes binary it becomes black and
white it loses all of the subtlety that
narrative is able to carry and so that
to me is one of the dangers of not
understanding how to use narrative how
to use mythology in story form to
transmit ideas because once you're not
using the narrative uh form factor to
transmit the ideas all you're left with
are speeches and essays and rhetoric and
when it gets broken down to rhetoric
like there's a really great nerd writer
episode on how Trump uses language and I
don't need you to to like or dislike
Trump but just looking at the way that
he uses language and how it it Narrows
the scope and now it narrows it very
effectively and that's one of the ways
that he's gotten where he's gotten is
understanding how to use language very
very effectively to cut through the
Clutter to very immediately go right
after the amydala in somebody's mind um
and that to me that's where um without
narrative without the subtlety of
empathy that can come through in a story
where you're connecting to characters
versus um dry binary black white yes no
ideology great that's awesome um
question from Ian ptit
sounds welcome welcome uh he says do you
think the reframing of traumatic
experiences via MDMA therapy is related
to the research cited in the Moran surf
episode we may need some i' I'd have to
go back and watch it I don't remember
the specific research in that well
enough to to answer okay I'm sorry man
well if you have some
clarification we'll get back to you on
that um another quote that stood out to
you I know that had a big impact during
the episode was uh was the best lack all
conviction while the worst are filled
with passionate intensity yeah so I'll
say it another way it's such a beautiful
quote but it's one that I think can skim
across people's minds um said another
way the the people with the best
intentions are unsure of themselves and
the people that don't necessarily have
the best intentions um they are con
vinced they're right and that's what
always that's what gets scary man so you
meet like there's a great quote I I
don't remember if it was said by a
scientist but it so applies to science
that that we'll just say it was said by
a scientist uh the less you know the
more certain you are the more you know
the less certain you are and that is so
true like think about how many 16 18 20y
olds think they know everything you meet
a 40-year-old they've had their ass
handed to them so many times they just
don't feel like that anymore like you
know like the more you begin to master a
topic the bigger the topic seems to get
like when you first start like if 10,000
hours is sort of the Baseline for uh the
beginning of Mastery if you will at hour
one what you're trying to master seems
like this at hour 10,000 it's like the
scope of it has changed so much and you
real you begin to realize the how subtle
little nuances make a world of
difference and learning to understand
that like in music they say it's not the
notes that's important it's the space
between the notes you don't know that on
day one right so like the way that
people conceive of the very Universe of
things that they're trying to do will
change the better you get at it so when
people are lost in aggression when
they're ignorant from the the stpoint
not of like willful ignorance they just
don't have all the facts like that's
when you're at your most convinced
because you think know the world seems
small everything seems very clear you
know exactly what needs to be done boom
let's go do it but when somebody really
knows when they really understand the
complexities that's when they're more
trepidacious because they they they have
become hyper aware of the things that
they don't know right and so yeah it
gets scary man all right another
question from Roman he says I've been
studying psychology and understanding
certain pattern patterns that drive your
brain uh I've been pretty successful at
breaking old negative habit habit
patterns however I found myself not yet
being able to replace those old habits
with positive new ones what is your
advice on creating new empowering habits
yeah so um habit Cycles are are pretty
straightforward so my advice is read um
hooked by near a all I think that's a
great place to start um and his name is
spelled nir separate word e y a l
um and yeah his book really breaks down
how to form habits how to break habits
what habit Loops are what habit triggers
are um and there's stages of a habit and
so the simple one is you're going to one
decide what is the Habit that I'm trying
to get into two what's going to be the
thing that triggers that um so I'll give
you an easy one for me going to the gym
the thing that Tri triggers my habit
Loop uh around that is waking up so the
very Act of waking up I then put my gym
clothes on like my gym clothes are the
only clothes that I set out for myself
so it's like I don't even have an option
so I get out of bed there are clothes
right there they are gym clothes I put
on gym clothes I go immediately to said
gym I work out so now it's like I've got
that the the trigger of waking up is the
trigger to go into the gym um
complimenting people uh I use the I I
felt and this really started with my
wife I felt that I was um I was
articulating my criticisms and even
though they paled in comparison to the
things I felt about her were just
amazing beyond all measure I didn't
articulate them so she would do
something sweet and I would be like oh
thank you so much but I wouldn't be like
oh my God like this is so amazing thank
you I really can't believe that you did
that and it's so thoughtful like really
going on the extreme or she walked by
and she looked really good and I would
just think wow she looks great today but
I wouldn't externalize it so but then if
um you know whatever something stupid
happened she um what is something that
my wife does my wife's she clean
everything it's hard to find something
to complain about my wife but whatever
she uh God I'm trying to even make
something up she does something anyway
that triggers me to say like hey don't
do that and I would think God that I
think to say out loud like that's so
crazy so I started saying the the
criticism itself needs to be a trigger
to compliment so if I thought hey don't
put that there oh here's a perfect one I
hate it when she tidies um like my keys
my wallet like I always put them in the
same place so don't move them so and she
would move them so I would think hey
don't move my stuff but instead of
saying that I'll say you know what I
actually really really appreciate the
fact that you keep the house tidy and
it's amazing like otherwise if it were
left to my devices this place would be a
mess and so using that impulse at first
which was a criticism to to force me to
focus on the compliment that so that you
get what you focus on so now I'm
thinking about that and I'm thinking
yeah like wow she really does this
amazing job so finding that hook that'll
lead into the Habit Loop but do you
still try to provide something
constructive with that or is it just go
into the opposite compliment oh um nine
times out of 10 it's literally just go
into the compliment because if the
criticism is important enough it'll
still be there for me when I'm done with
the compliment but usually the criticism
is so minor that it it's not worth even
bringing up like I know why she's
tidying up my stuff right there's people
coming whatever so rather than complain
about it just say hey what what's our
compromise right so you don't want it
left out awesome I need it in the same
place every time so is it if I put it in
this drawer can we agree that you'll
leave it right rather than just pissing
and moaning about it being mov
great um
okay I think that oh we have we have
explanation from Ian if we want to go
into that yeah let's get it so he says
Moran surf explained that you can change
your experience through revising
Memories by repeating them to yourself
in a different way such as through
therapy sessions similar to Daniel
Gilbert's so-called filling in trick I
think that by calling up memories while
in the positive and loving state of
ecstasis you infuse those memories with
that emotional state yeah 100% they they
are absolutely talking about the same
thing and this is um this is a a really
really powerful trick that I think more
people should figure out cuz your your
memories are a construct your memories
are
um they're not real they're not real and
I know that that is somewhat
controversial but man so many Studies
have been done on this the way that
people a you can you can actually get
people to confess to crimes that they
didn't do by planting the memories in
their minds I mean there's really famous
cases where people go to jail for like
20 years because they've had information
planted there was just one I was reading
about in um in fact I think it's the
book that I'm reading right now where
they talk about how this guy ends up
going to jail for like I don't know
however many years and when the police
chief or whoever was involved in the
case dies they then go through all of
his files and realize that he actually
had information that exonerated like
100% exonerated the person and he buried
it and so they know he was innocent and
yet he went to jail on a signed
confession that they got from him the
night that it happened and they
convinced him that he had killed his mom
and so you like it's just crazy so you
have to be aware of how malleable your
memories are but that can work to your
advantage so if there's something that
um like really bother I'll give you a
real one for my life um so it was like
really really important to my wife and
myself that I not see her in her dress
on the wedding day before she starts
walking down the aisle so I knew she's
Gathering like at the back of the church
and all that and and so I am facing
forward and it's in I'm used to the way
that they do it in America where because
this was in not only London but it was
in a Greek Church in London so here it's
like right and so ah you hear everybody
Stand Up the Music starts playing you
know the bride's coming turn around so
you're coming down the aisle now it
wasn't like that nobody said anything
all of a sudden my mom who knows why I'm
facing away goes she's almost here and
so I'm like say what I turn around and
my wife's like already 2/3 of the way up
the aisle I was heartbroken that I
didn't see her walk the first 23 and
literally in that moment I was like you
cannot focus on anything negative yeah
like you have got to like be in the
moment like don't even think about it
don't worry about it enjoy that you got
to see her come the last third it's
amazing yay this is your wedding day and
then after that I said I'm going to
watch the video of her walking down the
AIS and I'm going to put that in my mind
as like I saw her coming down the aisle
and that literally over time like now I
can picture her walking down the aisle
even though I didn't actually see it so
like you you have to understand like
this is my obsession with the brain you
have to understand how the brain works
have to have to have to have
to awesome all right I think we should
wrap it up there unless there's anything
else you want to touch on from this epis
no man I just really want people to
watch this one watch this one and yeah
I'm and call yourself out in the
comments like if you really respond to
the way that Jaime's mind works like I
just want to hear like he's so like
there's something about him I so enjoyed
uh I'm just curious to see like what
other people really respond to him in
the way that I did um and man since I'm
too big of a chicken to uh do drugs if
anybody else has had uh the experience
of easis uh through psychedelic means or
otherwise I would love to hear about
that as well let me live vicariously
through you guys uh would be amazing
definitely and we're going to be putting
out a number of different clips around
this episode on Facebook and some of our
other platforms so if you really like
this episode and you want to share those
and send them to other people I know I
realize it's sometimes hard to get
people to sit down for an entire hourong
episode but if you share one of these
two three minute 5 minute Clips where
it's really succinct some of the the key
points from that episode um we'd
appreciate it yeah that would be amazing
and please help support my boys Jamie
wheel and Steven Cotler by the book
stealing it's great it is a really
fascinating take on what easis is how to
get into the state uh it isn't drug
heavy they mention it as one of the
possible ways uh but they take a really
um clean clinical look at how all this
stuff is happening The Cutting Edge of
the brain research where it's at we
didn't even get a chance to talk about
um uh magnetic um trans crani trans
cranial magnetic stimulation thank you
dude um I was really struggling with
that one so there's there's all kinds of
really really interesting things
happening at the Forefront of brain
science so check it out they go into it
in the book the book is really a great
read and they are great writers so it's
just fun to read stealing fire it is out
now go check it out you guys are going
to love this one thank you so much for
joining us today I absolutely absolutely
love filming these after impacts we
thank you guys so much for showing up
especially in the live audience thank
you guys for that for asking your
questions really appreciate it and until
next time my friends be legendary take
care bye peace