Kind: captions
Language: en
hello
hello ah yeah but but hello hello
good good good yeah
yeah i can hear you
yeah great great all right okay
great that's good that was better yeah
yeah
great good so i think so satria will
we'll start satori yeah uh allow me to
start sir
because it's already 8 27 and we will
start the session at 8 30.
so let me do the opening sentence
and allow me to introduce professor
anglo as well
okay i'm going to share my screen
excuse me
okay first of all
good morning ladies and gentlemen before
we start the presentations and in order
to avoid any disturbances
during the presentations later i would
like to ask everyone here
to mute their zoom
add honorable speakers distinguished
guests fellow audiences
ladies and gentlemen good morning to all
of the participants in the training
course
and also my warmest greetings to the
audiences that are watching from our
youtube channel
my name is atria and i am pleased to
tell you that i will be act as
this morning sessions moderator first of
all
i would like to welcome you all to our
previous webinar about technical aspect
on wastewater treatment held by center
of environmental studies
bandung institute of technology in this
occasion
we shall have an outstanding
presentation from our prominence
presenters pakistan
who is already here at the room whom i
believe shall enrich our insights and
knowledge regarding the theme of the
seminar
especially on membrane bioreactor and
wastewater treatment
before the presentations begin allow me
to introduce the presenter
our presenter today is professor hu
hongo
and he is a professor of environmental
engineering from uts or university of
technology sydney australia
professor ngo is currently a professor
in environmental engineering and serving
as a deputy director
of center of technology in water and
with water co-director of joint research
center
for protective infrastructure technology
and environmental green bio process
school of civil and environmental
engineering faculty of engineering and
information technology
university of technology sydney
professor dango is internationally well
known for his activities
in the areas of advanced biological
wastewater technologies
and membrane technologies and he has
published more than 500 technical papers
including more than 350 sci journal
papers
over 100 conference papers 4 books and
28 book chapters
and a number of patents while receiving
several highly recognized honors and
awards
so without further ado because mr
erica's professor
is already here i would like to welcome
our presenter
and professor law will deliver a
presentation entitled
an arabic membrane director for future
sustainable with water treatment
for just a few audiences from whether in
the zoom meeting room or the audience in
the live youtube
you can ask questions by typing in the
live chat
column or we're typing in the zoom chat
feature so ladies and gentlemen uh
uh please welcome professor wu hong kong
and professor hu humble
this session is yours thank you
okay please oh
uh good good morning everyone good
morning
thank you thank you very much for very
nice
introduction and so that's why i'm not
going
to talk about myself for further
i mean like the information but uh
anyway
firstly i would like to thank you so
much
professor uh
is my good and old friend
and that is such and this is the first
time for me
to attend uh your research center
webinar that is yeah this is the first
time
and i'm very happy about it thank you
okay so today i would like to
discuss with you all regarding an arabic
membrane bioreactors for future
sustainable
westward treatment in fact that
i mean like the recent days an arabic
mbr
i mean it seemed to be very very hot
topic
and it seemed to i think about 10 years
ago
at that time i tried to convince the
people
show russia wood and arabic nbr but i
mean the people is not really
i mean recognize this kind of
technologies
but currently completely different
thousands and thousands of the
researchers started
i mean like that uh work on that time
the n and arabic membrane bioreactors
so this is the the way i mean today i
try to
say about that and and and
and just let you know is that
that technology
will be a future sustainable west water
treatment
okay so the content whatever i want to
talk today is this quite a lot
so firstly just go to the background
first
okay so you can see it's a it's a third
generation when we want to treat the
wash water
you can see very lengthy process from
the pre-treatment
come to the primary and then we go to
the
the the i mean like the biological
treatment process
and go to the secondary clarifier and
then we go
further for chemicals sedimentation and
then sand filter
and this infection then we can recharge
our waste water to the receiving water
bodies
and then it's too long so that we think
about the second generation
so in the chicken generation we shortcut
here
that mean is that after the second
clarifier we go for the same filter
and then this infection and just
recharge the wash water
but still not good so we go
to another generation we say a third
generation
and then that is a really really short
and it seems to be
we only need the pre-treatment and then
and beyond membrane bioreactors and this
is the
bioset membrane bioreactor is that about
i think it's at
seven uh 17 years ago
that already reached the third
generation
okay so now we just see
the conventional west water treatment
why they have
some disadvantages and we need to
use some i mean alternative technology
or something like that to support
for for for the conventional west water
treatment
firstly think about it when we talk
about the conventional wastewater
treatment
until now no way we can use conventional
wastewater treatment
for the centralized system no way we
cannot you for
even one building or even one apartment
or whatever
or school or something like that or
hospital no way
so that is that we send center line
feature
and then missing with very fresh water
because in somehow from the uh from the
the westward treatment plant
we may i mean combined with some
industrial or something like that
together
so that is the way because uh it's quite
far
and quite long and the pie line is a
very very land
very long and then substantial chemical
use
i show you the process think about it
whatever how much chemical
we add into this process to make that
to make that uh i mean like uh
to reach the the discharge standard i
mean effluent
so this is another disadvantages
and then the messy residue the slot
production is unbelievable
and then we spend a lot of money just
because of that to treat the sludge
because the wash water as you know
exactly we treat the wash water only
fifty percent
of the cost and the slots we need to
spend
another fifty percent to treat the slug
but sometimes it's more than that
in fact maybe sixty percent but wash
water only 40
now we come the value of recovery
resource
research recovery this day is really
important
because we aim for the zero waste
and also we want to convert waste
to become the the valuable
resources and then the conventional
wastewater can't do this
this is that this can't they just only
the the
function generally remove remove remove
the pollutant remove the pollutant and
each other
the wash water that is unfortunately
and then inflatability why we say
inflexibility because it's long process
and also we cannot just for example
500 people 5 000 people 50 000 people
000 people it's not flexible when we
design like that
because the bio reactor especially for
the
hash rt the the hydraulic retention term
the volume and then in different ways
that
we can't be not very flexible
in i mean design the system and their
bestie
footprint i mentioned you is that of
course it needs
a lot of i mean like the big uh volume
units
and then it's the best space to have the
conventional watch water treatment and
then
energy intensity just
because when we talk about that is that
almost is that
the pump pump and pump and pump do it
into the process and that is
especially any future it costs a lot of
money
because the energy consumption uh
consumption is
very very high so then the conclusion is
go
to what first money second energy
and then experts and then is that value
length
that it will in fact sorry will have
impacts on this kind of thing one two
three four
and that is a really the matter it
really doesn't matter
okay so now the people before about 15
years ago 20 years ago they will just
only think about a heroic mbr we got
very popular even until now
quite i mean a lot of countries still i
mean
like apply the arabic nbrs and we'll see
the nba the m the arabic in the office
all right arabic by reactor
for example activated sludge or i mean
trickling filter
or i mean like the us sorry
for the this is the arabic
mbl and then we add
the membrane either inside the
arabic barrier or outside the arabic
barrier
and then this the definition is nbr
the nbr is in fact is not is quite
simple
but when the people think about arabic
and arabic and
they think about the membrane can do
the i mean by all function no not at all
the membrane only do the physical
filtration
not not not more than that not more than
that okay
so this is the definition of the arabic
mpo now we come to that
what is the i mean like the the
the merits of the arabic mbr
it's a good thing just like that you see
this is a basic thing
why we use the membrane form the
membrane is that stop first because
filtration
so they separate i mean like the i mean
like the
the solids okay and then we will have a
clean water
but at the same time the membrane can
i mean retain the micro organism
for for for us to do the job they are
cleaner
so if we wash out on the i mean like the
the micro organism then we do not have
any cleaner
uh to to treat the wash water for us so
that is the thing
and here you can see solace and
microorganism retain
separate you can see this is the point
all right
so now come to what come to the
the the advantages that first of all
excellent microbial separation ability
because they can keep they can retain
the microorganism second thing is that
control the
uh the amino acid is easy to control the
hydraulic retention time or stroke
retention time and just because of that
very flexible very flexible we can
design
only for five people or 50 people of
even
10 000 people still okay we can use
the mbr all right but it's not is
is is a very good thing is that smaller
footprint because for the uh for the mbr
even if then 10 000 or 10 or whatever
the hrt it's only three to six hour to
eight hours
it's not like the other battery after go
to 12 days
for example or even even a month
this is just because of that it's really
big i mean
big footprint right but for mbr very
small for free
and then low rate slash production this
is the i mean like the good news
for the people who like to use that the
mbr
because the slot production is very less
and then we can save the money from the
slot treatment
and then high biomat content so that
means about 10 to 20 grams later
we need that i mean like the the the
quantity of the micro
organism to do the job but uh
but the good thing because if for the
activated slug for example
they may use only five gram per liter
and if more than not
they have to i mean they have to control
the hrt and also they have to replace
the slush
and a lot of them there so the it's not
good
so this is a high biomat is really
really i mean like crucial
i mean like for the mbr and then
flexible is all right
and then the last one you can see is
high
quality because after the arabic mbr
whatever they recharge
the quality is quite high okay the
quality is very high
all right so now however why i put
however because yeah so arabic
nbr is very good very good very good but
that's the
very important is that aeration
because we need the air pump we need the
air diffusion to provide
the air into the system continuously we
cannot stop
so that's why the energy consumption is
very high
and that why is that we have to think
about it
and when we want to think about it then
we have to think about
an arabic mbr and that
i just said about the energy consumption
but the other one is even
much more important that is
we can produce the bible energy
but the arabic mba cannot produce
bible yes in arabic area 100
can produce biogas
right so this is i mean just just
something we have to think about
an arabic mbr and then we have to make
it
for i mean like to become very popular i
mean i
asked the arabic mbr we use
at the moment okay so now
we just see i mean like the the the
i mean like we just see the whole thing
is that about the
eve evolution of the an element and
beyond
when we when you when we do like us
i mean is that we start only start from
the
1978 for the first in arabic nbr
okay and then the i mean professor hans
is a very
i mean like the very favorite person at
that time
who invented i mean lighter and arabic
mbr
in that only lab scale but come to the
come to the 19th sorry come to the 1984
the inedible nbr become the first
commercial
okay the third commercial in arabic in
beyond
whenever they treat exact on mod like
the
more in the industry waste rather than
i mean like the uh domestic wastewater
and then in 1987 we have
the an arabic digestion ultra filtration
and then they try they try in the pilot
scale
and full scale plants or something like
that and
very good as well because successful in
a full scale
and the full scale is that you say a lot
of technology
they only reach to the i mean final
scale
and then finished for example mfc
it's nothing there in i mean for the
full scale
for example i just say so is that
successful in 1987 already successful
and then uh 2009
we have a very nice um
mbr full scale in food and
para para beverage
industry very successful at the full
scale
again that food scale and then 20 and 10
the largest one the largest one is that
an
arabic mba food waste water treatment
so that is that that is the story about
that of course is um
quite a few lab scale you know we work
in the lab or something something
is quite i mean like successful quite
successful
and then one of thing is that for
example i just say here
because the slide i mean like the uh the
animation have some problem
so that's the reason i can't show you
step by step but anyway
just one good one here you can show is
that
the performance for i mean like the
inanimate mbr
to treat to treat that the cannes food i
mean by the foods the
waste foods wash water and the cod
removal
up to 99.4 suspended solid removal 100
percent
and then meet him that's the bio gas
production
up to 8 500 cubic meter per day
you can see it's quite good in fact is
that when we look it's
very i mean like very attractive
but in fact it's not like that
it's not like that so like the reasons
quite a lot of countries they still
don't like
to use an arabic mbl we have some i mean
like the disadvantage
and i will talk to you later on
okay so after the background after we
understand then we go to an animated
configuration
and what is that you just see very easy
we have an arabic bio-reactor what means
an element of course you
everyone should know about that arabic
with oxygen
and arabic completely without oxygen
okay
and then if we put the membrane
outside the i mean the bioreactor
that is the external blood flow and
element mbr
but if we put the membrane inside the
an arabic mbr the bio sorry an arabic
bioreactor then we can have a submerged
an arabic and beyond
and then you can see the mem and then we
can divide into groups
the first group is that we put the
membrane inside the bioreactor
the second group is that we put the
membrane inside a
separated bioreactor it's very
interesting
and then you will see the this one is
external blood flow and alphabet ambient
you can see we have a glove flow
membrane
module here and then we can have an
arabic bioreactor here
and then they produce the biogas you can
see the blue has a
and then the this influence coming and
then
effluent come out but the sludge
so that means we have to recirculate
back to the and add a bit mbr all right
and here we can have a slot retention
term
controller so it depends on i mean the
slot you you just say
about three months six months i mean one
year or whatever but of course we want
to have a
as long as possible the slot retention
time
so just just because of that
we just i mean like just say something
about the
external graph flow and arabic mbr
the advantage high flux yes
easy clean and replacement because they
put it separately
the membrane in the other units so very
easy for cleaning
and replacing or replacing something
like that
but unfortunately because they use the
feeding
and go to the cross road membrane and
recirculate back to the
an arabic npr so the
the energy energy consumption is high
and then is that we need to to clean
very often
also because of that and the last one is
description of biomass activity
the people say what mean you what you
mean description of biomass
activity because you see
if we only want here and you put the
membrane
inside when we retain the the
microorganism in that bioreactor so they
keep doing the work
they need not to go through the the the
other module and then reserve it back
so that the reason is
i mean like discussion and then
i mean like the the of course bacterials
they are not happy because one day they
keep
moving moving moving again and again and
again something like that
right so this is the disadvantages
now we go to the submerged and arabic
mbr
very simple we only put the membrane
inside
i mean like the the the the an element
by all reactor
yes we have a biogas here and then
envelopement
and then effluent this one is vacuum
suction pump
the other one is feeding pump good force
from feeding
this one is suction suction pump okay
vacuum pump
all right and then similarly we have hrt
controller that's just a slot retention
here
and then just symbol like that this is
very simple
but the advantage and the disadvantage
we can see yes the energy is lower
because you one unit
and very simple we can design easily
and operation condition because it's
like whatever
in one unit so condition is is quite
okay
disadvantages we are not really happy
about the uh removal efficiency
even i mean like the organic removal
efficiency like cod
bod and the neutron removal efficiency
is quite
quite bad so that means quite low okay
so what the people think okay just like
because of that why don't we do another
idea
that means two-stage submer
and arabic nbr so that means they have
one an arabic bioreducta here
and then another i mean another one so
that means we have two but
we put in the second one we put the
the the membrane inside the excel by
reactor
so that means that this is the concept
they send back
the base recently and they recirculate
the sludge back to the first and
eleventh bioreactor
to support for the biological i mean
like the process
all right so this one of course when we
see like that
we are very happy because of what
higher removal efficiency and gas
production because double
think about it's a double double so that
means gas here
sorry gas here and
uh gas here and gas here and also even
whatever
we have the better i mean much better
the efficiency
but disadvantage is yes we have to pay
for that
you just remember is that whatever we
pay whatever we get
that is the point this is a principle so
we can't i mean like when we want to
have the better
removal efficiency and the gap
production we have to pay for that
all right so after i mean i just
interviewed about the inadequate uh
mbr configuration so now
we just have a little bit idea about the
pollutant removal
from an element mbr
let's get you can just see the lab scale
whatever a different times of the west
water
you can see from the palm oil mule or
i mean like the slab the house or
leeches
or whatever and then they control in
different
arc net loading rate hydraulic retention
time
slot retention time i mean like the and
then the
total suspended solar so that means the
biomass from the beginning
they put a sorry the total suspended
solid that
for that kind for for these kind of
treatment technologies and then what we
just see from here
the cod removals not too bad especially
for palm oil mill
from 96 to 99 and for example
the the pre-worry which supplement is
more than 97 and then the crop
evaporator condensate or something 97 so
muscle
i mean like a few only the fuel is very
i mean very a lot for example
slap the how it's not really good
because that
the rent is too big like this also the
second one the thermo mechanical popping
brush stage also it's not so good or
something
so that in the lab scale we can see the
weakness
of the inherited npr it's not really
i mean like perfect in the way like we
use the element
mbr uh systems all right
and then we go to the municipal
wastewater now
from many renewable waste water they use
in different i mean like uh uh um
um configuration
they have some summer mbr external mbr
of the m element mbr
s101 s101 and separate one
so when you see like that you can see
about the removal efficiency in somehow
it's not really i mean like the
impressive
just only that suspended services that
is quite impressive but this one's
88 and this one is about
i think it's about 46
and for the external one is that um
you can see the cod only 87
73 or something like that and this one
is 88
so it's not really impressive
that that's the reason why the people is
a little bit late
to apply this i mean like the technology
okay so now the summary we can say high
removal rate
of cod and tsx but i just say tss
yes really high but still
very i mean like the uncertain
so that means that's sometimes very high
sometimes very low
and during the day up and down quite a
lot it's not stable
okay and the moderate removal rays
of endocrine active compounds and
pharmaceutical articun power or
something like that
is not bad when we use an arabian to
remove that
and even uh an arabic uh sorry the
antibiotic antibiotic
we work on that and we know it's pretty
good as well
but though very sadly say
low total nitrogen and total phosphorous
remove
removal rate low very low so that's why
is that very disappointed about this
system
about the neutron removal
okay so now we go from the left scale
we go further we will see about the
pilot and the phone scale
what is the pilot and the phone scale
then
because only the pilot and full scale we
can see whether
it's applicable or not whether we can
really
go ahead with that but not the lab scale
not the left side
all right and then what we just see here
for the different kind of the wash water
okay we say for example external things
spillage
snack factory waste water potassium
processing or food processing
etc and then it's the good news when we
go to
pilot and the full scale we just see the
cod
removal here 98 97
95 99 99.4
so that is the really really good news
but when we say the good news we need to
be very careful
i mean what we say very careful about
the i mean like the the flush
because the the flash is very low
only 4.3 liter per square meter hour
very low this one is okay this one is i
mean a
up to eight is all right but this one
very low and this one
extremely low 0.83 to 5
i mean that's very low this one also
very low
so even though we have a high
i mean like the cod removal efficiency
but we still need to consider
all right so that is the thing now
we come up with the real application of
an arabic mbr in the world
and i selected i mean about three
case studies and let you know is that
data
the first one is an arabic submerged
hollow fiber mbr
power scale in spain and that is the
thing is that
i just want you to have a look at that
this is that they are running
and the cod removal up to 97
roughly that and the bio gas
mi 10 you i mean like 0.069
liter per gram cod very low
that is not good at all the theoretical
i mean like the uh sorry
the thick the theoretical uh meat engine
is 0.294
and this one's only 0.096 uh sorry on
0.06 we're too far away from the
theoretical i mean value
so that is not a successful i mean like
the
case study now
we go to the case study too kubota
process
this one is completely different story
this one
is really really successful about the an
arabic mbr what they said is that
they have the i mean like
solubilizations
and then they have a thermophilic and
mesophilic digester
okay whatever they have but the only
thing we don't care
whatever they they just want to have
that bio
gas linked with the super membrane
react uh super membrane i mean reactor
all right and then they can discharge
and then they have a okay to they they i
mean like they
sacrifice or they meet the i mean they
charge standard
so that is the good point here but
another good one is that
they produce a lot the system the
inanimate mbr producers are
a very high biogas for
by power generating facility boiler and
so on
so that system is that they don't need
to use
the normal like core space electricity
or something like that
they rely on out on their own
i mean like the inanimate mbr system
to support the electricity so that is a
really success sustainable
really sustainable and the west water is
the show too
you know the that kind of the alcohol i
mean japanese
and korean they love very much shoju
when we talk about shoju
you know that about that and because of
the very successful
so kuputa they already in in
in japan uh until 2010
they have already have 15
full scale plants all right
so this is that one successful and then
about the membrane okay about the
membrane they can retain the
methanogenic material
that the the bacteria produce the
biomethane
okay and then they can filter out this
old
mutant inhibitor such as i mean
ammonia so that means they very good
in the biogas production i mean in
somehow because they have a two
two good point and then the digester
basically normally the giant for example
one cubic meter
but for this one become only i mean
0.2 cubic meter or i mean 0.2
cubic meter or something like that
because
the volume is about
what sorry about one third to one fifth
times
of the traditional digestion and the
biomass three to two times
to three to five times of the
traditional
digestion is that really the good news
because the more number of the biomass
the better because they eat more we just
say eat
they eat more they break they break down
more
organic matter so that the reason they
can remove
i mean they can convert the organic
matter to become biogas and at the same
time
they can remove almost the organic
matter in the waste water
so that is the pretty pretty good okay
so now another happy case study
whatever i'd like to show you
that is the it seems to be very new one
this is just only five years ago very
new brand new
i mean like something like that and then
what you just say here
this is the distillery waste treatment
by violia
i mean uk in scotland
and then the distillery whatever they
have the pot
out they have a waste water they have a
spent
uh at least every duck whatever
the wash water to come with the total
flow rate
is 400 cubic meter per day
and then it's at about 12 tons
cod pd so when they come to that
an edible mbr here in arabic and we are
here
they produce 5 500 cubic meter per day
biogas when we talk about bio gas so
that mean
definitely the major one is the methane
and then nitrogen for example
all the hydrogen supplement i mean like
the
uh the that kind of i mean like gas
okay but major one is the methane
and gene is that this kind of biogas
can support sorry can generate
1600 kilowatts
per day right so that is really really
nice
i mean every day they from this quest
to convert to that one thousand and
secondary
kilowatt per day and at the same time
they can treat very nicely
i mean like the tendency very nicely
uh the wash water to reach her
to the water course without any problem
so that means they don't react they
can't they don't
uh they don't cause the pollution water
pollution problem
but at the same time they can produce
such a good i mean like the bio energy
okay so now we come to that
the biogas production when we talk about
biogas production we just think about it
west minimization
because that's uh the why we have to
think that way
because the convert the converter from
for example this that the
per gram cod removed and this one
is the the sludge production
okay so this one for inadequate ambiance
only 0.031 and this one is 0.420 gram
too far away so that means herbert mbr
produce large much much more than
an adamant mbr so that is why we
like an arabic mbr we are an arabic and
we are to become i think kind
of the green and sustainable just
because of that
search hrt for an arabic mbr
long srt for an arabic mbr
then we can have a low slush u and then
we can spend less money for
slot handling and disposal
cost this is the biogas production
actually you can see from this i mean
live figure
it's very easy to understand that we
have
the i mean in the in the west water
normally it's complex organic matter is
it
and then we come we need uh in the wash
water
the bus way the conversion pathway will
go to the first stage
okay that means hydrolysis and then
the complex organic matter to become
soluble okay
molecularly and then the second stay
to convert to valentine fatty acids and
then
the voluntary fatty acid will convert to
the
uh hydrogen carbon dioxide or acetic
acid
and these are very sensitive this
display is really really sensitive
because if we don't want to go further
we have a clean i mean if we don't have
we'll have a clean bio hydrogen
and then if we go further then we have a
meeting
but mutant is not clean i mean we go
through the
i mean like the conversion or something
they become the gringa and the green
guys
uh sorry the green gas emission okay
greenhouse gas emission all right
so this kind of thing that when we come
to the biogas production
you can see so good bioware conversion
efficiency up to 98 percent
me 10 years at up to i mean 0.33 liter
me 10 per gram series removal and
methane up the volume per volume value
normally 90 percent so that means it's
mid 10 is the main one
and the energy generation raises about
2.02 kilowatt
hour per kilogram vod reboot
all right so this one is pretty fast we
just see is that about the meat
and i mean like production
0.31 2.34
cubic meter per kilogram
silly removed so that mean one kilogram
cod removed
we will have that 0.31 2.34
cubic meter the only thing we need to
think about it
when we work on the mid-10 we can have a
headache is the result
meeting because why we cannot collect
100 retain
from the the the treatment from the
inanimate mbo
because that's almost about 50
or i mean 40 percent or whatever they
dissolve in the waste water
so when we discharge the westward out
ca4 will go to the air and create
the global warming problem so that
in the future i suggest the researcher
think about it
how to reduce the result meeting
how to review the disobedience and
increase that the meeting
i mean like the collection quantity
all right this is a very interesting
research
okay and the operating parameter for
biogas production
and you know that is the four main four
main
uh operating parameters is one is
temperature
okay temperature is we have a cycle
profile
like the uh uh 10 about you know like
about
10 to 15 cents a degree or something
methyl
methyl mesophilic about i think 25 to
35 roughly like that thermoflix about
45 to 85 or something like that
but whatever why we have different kind
of temperature
because the temperature difference the
removal efficiency will be different
the the the mbr
reactor size is different as well very
very i mean that
significant impact because of the
temperature
the ph is the rain about 5.5 to 8.2
so that's all right the hrt
lower hrt we will have the smaller
reactor of course
because rt is that equal v divided by q
shows the volume the height is higher
the volume
of course bigger the h the slot
retention time srt it's a longer one
so we will have a lower slot u but the
only thing is that the longer one they
will have
that kind of h and maybe
the removal efficiency will will not the
same so that means
that lower removal efficient pollutant
remove
efficiency all right the inhibitors
to biogas production yes we have problem
if the ammonia higher than and 500
milligram liter
they become the inhibitor for the
i mean the bioga production like survive
okay the ratio between cod and
sulfide should be lower than 10.
salinity
i mean 50 activity
inhibitory i mean concentrations about
25 grams
sodium per liter and then
the last one is that we need very low
long chain fatty acids
all right so now the drawback of an
arabic mbr
that means we have problem with because
the first stage is that
the vfa the voluntary fatty acid
accumulation then is that they will make
the problem
because the ph value will i mean will
changes
and react the problem for the whole
system
methanogenic inhibition we just say
about the ammonia i just say about the
surface
we just say about the uh the long chain
the the the fatty acids or something
like that
then we just think about this is the
problem
so why we have up and down too much per
day
is not really stable just because of
that
and uh unstable i mean process and
serious membrane following
as you know is a very heavy one for the
membrane following
and then low nutrient removal efficiency
so that we have a one two three four
five that's the five major and drawbacks
of an advent mbr okay
so the my amendment following are just
very pretty uh
very quick to go through because the
time constraint
but anyway you know is that the membrane
fouling
really more serious
i mean like the reason why the people
don't lie to you the an arabic npr
quite serious okay because when the
falling
then the i mean that the treatment slot
will drop
and then the system downtime is higher
and then we have to clean the uh
we have to clean the membrane with the
chemical or physical cleaning
and we have to increase the gas scarring
and slug recirculation
and then the membrane become i mean to
get that
the shorter time so the night time is
short
and then of course we have to pay the
money for that
so that is not good the following
mechanism
i i show you to uh i show you here for
this
figure you can see we have a k formula
we have a poor
construction and termini uh
term mediate blocking or complete
blocking
and that kind of thing you just see is
that because inside the work video we
have a slot flux
we have colors we have solutes all right
so this for the pore construction is
very easy to see
because that is the i mean like the
smaller than the pore side they come
inside and they create the
blocking problem and the k from
k formation we have to think about is
that whatever
they drop to do to on each other
so that means firstly it's all right but
after some time they become
the cake they come that layer and they
block
the thing and they left very difficult
for the water
to flow through okay and intermediate is
similar because the block the
blocking from the beginning i mean the
part the the particle to come
arriving on the already i mean like the
axis
in the on the membrane or something like
that and then just because of that
later stay is the k for formation
and complete blocking easy we call the
side to be
so that means outside they block the
the fully blocked the port okay fully
block the pole
outside it's not inside this is the
inside
all right and then we have the colorado
fouling we have organic filing
we have a bio fouling in organic filing
but i just want to say about biofueling
because for an
adamant mbr the more serious reason is
the biofouling
because the microbial micro
uh microorganism they grow
on the i mean on the water surface and
even
inside the pore that is a problem and
when they grow like that
they just react touch the bible
i mean like the fouling and then that
kind of following is very headed
because we cannot do the physical i mean
like the
the technology
to treat that we have to combine
physical and chemical
and something to treat the the bio
fouling
and then when this this one is that i
just very short to explain to you in
that
if we want to control the volume we have
to go from the membrane characteristic
character that means membrane pro
properties
okay like the like the roughness like
the surface charge
this kind of thing or porcelain and then
the membrane operation
the condition for example flush a batch
work relaxation
cleaning or something and then we have
to consider
the biryata operation this one
is that like the h star at rt hrt
or temperature or pf value of this kind
of thing
all right and the substrate comes
for example like you just see about the
uh about the uh the particular cod for
example
this is the thing but maintaining if you
learn about the membrane fouling we
always tell
about the smp that means soluble
microbial products or the
eps so that means extra and
extracellular polymetric substances
okay so this is that kind of that's the
the slide here you can see this is the
way we think
to control the fouling
and then the following management yes i
i'm i i i i discuss with you already
but mandarin cleaning we need to know
the proper i mean proper way
to clean the membrane and then is
normally we talk about the physical
cleaning on
and chemical cleaning and
physical cleaning and and
what is that the chemical cleaning
strategy is here
for this slide i just show you when we
have
inaugurated fouling for example we can
go for chemical cleaning
for example particulate or corner or
i mean like the fouling then we use
chemical cleaning and then we can use
the back backwash
okay cleaning or something then no
problem
but come to the biological uh
biofollowing sorry i just say biofolin
then we have that cleaning we have
logarination and then we have the
acidification and then chemical cleaning
all right so on this kind of thing we
have to
to treat we have to show the biofolding
not easy not easy organic easy
organic we just use the coordination or
chemical cleaning
it should be okay
then we go to the
develop hydraulic and adept mbr
why we have to have a hybrid as you know
is a hybrid that means
we have combined uh different units
together
and then to make it to make is that the
higher
removal efficiency or i mean that the
performance higher performance
and then here the inanimate nbr
the weakness is the removal efficiency
so that's the reason
so that the reason you can see we need
to have the pre-treatment
and then we have a poor treatment as
well for an elevated mbr
and then to enhance the process
stability
to enhance the effluent quality
uh to improve the bio energy production
and treatment capacity
all right and the case study is just so
very
quick to go through that the case study
we have the an arabic data mbr
and the fluid flu um the arabic
fluid um an arab fluid
the bio reactor or something like that
to you in the slapter i mean like the
house uh west treatment and then they
can do
a good job for example overcome vfa
accumulation
and then to stay in adept nbr to tweak
the
cheese way then we can have excellent
treatment performance for the high
loading waste water
for example and then we use the apr
with that time the the
with the uh inadequate mbr we just say
is that because
this kind of thing when we use for the
domestic waste water
we think is that whether it's worth it
to do it
okay and then when they combine the two
i mean like the
two uh system and
if we don't have energy cost reduction
in if we don't have
efficient meat and production forget it
we are not going to cut
to pay the money for two units to
combine together
and the hydrogen delivery unit with an
animated mbr which is a municipal
final effluent reduced nitrate below the
detect
detachable level that's just only the
nitric they focus on an ij
so this kind of thing i just show you
through that
we have the outflow arabic slug
blanket usb and then together
we can have the biogas it's good
bio gap production and i think
is that a really attractive one with the
0.42
cubic meter meter per cubic bit a day
all right and then we use expanded
granular slope that
and then we use together with the
membrane then we have a
pretty go up to 0.58 cubic meter
meter per day per per day per cubit
uh wastewater per day as well
and for the an arabic fluoride back
reactor
uh with the membrane unit then
we just have that uh the 4.11 mole
meter per cubic meter and then the last
one i just want to
i mean introduce is that an element
dynamic
membrane bioreactors and this one uh
even though we can see it's not really i
mean go to
very high bio i mean like the methane
production
but the good thing is that about the
membrane
because the diamond membrane you just
say the diamonds
that mean we only need to have some base
and then the solids is that to be off
there
and then they become the membrane but we
need not
use like actual filtration or micro
filtration
or something like that no we don't need
to
okay and then sorry another an advent
membrane distillation this is the i mean
like the latest
technologies about the the the md
okay and then we use that
under the an advert condition so then
we can have that and also an every
automatic membrane by reactors so when
we talk like that
the automatic one maybe i mean like the
on
actually we cannot say maybe we have to
say should be the forward or mercy
okay because the the river almost see
normally we you are the poor treatment
we never use in that
i mean like the the the i mean like the
pre-treatment or something with the
bioreactor
okay so now we go to the sustainability
analysis and future purposes
what is that what is sustainability
analysis
that the reason is that when we talk we
need to have
some analysis to go
to the conclusions otherwise very hard
to say is an arabic is the future
sustainable westward treatment
technology no
we can't so this is that through
my i mean like the introduction
and discussion about we just see we know
the west minimization significant
from the inedible mbr because slush
production is very
very low renewable energy
production yes because only an element
area have
so renewable energy production yes the
answer
100 review footprint yes
again because for example we don't need
to have
i mean days days and days
for the i mean for the uh for the
what hrt and then
excellent effluent quality
this kind of thing that's when we say
yes we a little bit
second because it's true
that one is that it depends on how you
think
excellent excellent quality when we
yield up the
hybrid system and adamant mbr
hybrid system this kind of azure
is 100 yes
excellent effluent quantity so anyway
when we satisfy for four i mean
in term of that we can say
yeah this an element is quite
sustainable
all right and now it's very interesting
we want to to to make the comparison
from the different indicators for where
for example
from the organic removal to the bio
recovery to mode
of treatment footprint biomass retention
nutrient requirement
whatever in there to make the comparison
and then you can see that is interesting
here
arabic treatment and animal treatment
arabic mbr and an arabic mbr
okay so now what we do is that we
count on the red color whatever i just
made
so that means arabic treatment they have
a two top
so that means two good thing and and
edible treatment have
one two three four five yes they have a
fight
adamant mbr have one two
three four five six and then
for the uh for the inanimate mbr
i have one two three four five six seven
so when we make that kind of comparison
we are very happy to think about an
arabic mpo all right just think about an
arab
embryo and then we are smart enough to
deal the arabic
bioreactor or some of the other
bioreactor to support
an arab mbr as the pre-treatment
of post treatment
all right the future publicity that is
my suggestion about it when we talk
about the future publicity we have to
think
how to apply the an arabic
nbr in the very i mean like the
reasonable way so get that the people
i mean except for in the whole world
it's not
only one or two countries or something
only thing we can do
is that life cycle assessment
because in the future definitely we have
to do
a lot of research about the inedible
mbr using life cycle
i mean assessment or we have to think
about
circular bible economy
because that's the only thing you can
say to the people yet
and arabic they already satisfy for this
kind of thing
and that kind of analysis or something
like that
and then the second thing is an arabic
fouling control in fact is that at the
moment
we do not have a lot
about the membrane falling in an arabian
embryo
it's not like arabic in vr we have a lot
of pressures
i mean like on that and we have a kawaii
i mean enlightened
almost saturation about that but it's
not
about the inadequate falling control or
an arabic membrane founding we need to
do much more
so that is the future what we need to do
okay
so number three multi-state hybrid and
arabic
mbr system that is we need to be
smart enough to combine with the other
to make an arabic uh mbr become perfect
or become i mean like the really the
sustainable system
all right so this is that a lot of
research we have to go
because we cannot just say is that you
know whenever we check another we
put in together as a hybrid no way
because we need that
the the the what we say appropriate
or i mean something with the the optimal
one or some something so this is that uh
think about it system control to achieve
optimal biogas recovery
this one is another thing we
have to work on especially for the
operating
condition operation this bioreactor
operating condition all we have to think
about
nz how we make more i mean how do
different kind of enzyme
to support for the pathway for four
different pathway
to increase the biogas such as
production and the last one is really
interesting
research on microbial community
structure and
is influenced in fact
if we generally say removal very simple
because an arabic breakdown the organic
we know
everyone know about it okay very clearly
but come to the microbial community
that is the thing we can do some
research
about the community and we kind of
community
it's really uh a a main thing
to support especially for bio
gas production a lot of work
a lot of research we can do about it and
this is a little bit more
microbiology but we need to we need to
okay
so this is uh this is another good for
the future
bestie on the an advent
mbr development okay
so now about the conclusion
the conclusion is very straightforward
and adequate
ambiance potential for various terms of
wastewater
at iso do you industry waste water
municipal wastewater
i mean domestic wet water whatever they
can use
and then this is quite sustainable
technology
at the moment we can think about it but
we have to do a lot of work to brood
to convince the people all right biogas
recovery
renew the greenhouse gas emission and
provide energy
that is the fact because when we have
the biogas recovery of course that's uh
we review the greenhouse gas emission
and provide the energy because we try to
collect the biogas and we yield for the
i mean like the bio energy
okay complex digestion is influenced by
many
factors and then in fact that
mostly we just need to play around with
four key factors one is the
ps second is temperature third is hrt
and the last one is hrt and then
the last one it seems to be
the most important one because we cannot
only
work in the lab with the lab scale
how good it is it's not going to help
if we really to make the practical
application
we need to study at the large or even go
to
that commercial scale so they mean go up
to full scale pilot scale
because from that scale we have to go to
the final scale
from panel scale we go to full scale and
then that only that
we can apply the technology okay
so when we have a with the with the
large scale
so then we need to talk to the people uh
with the large scale
about the biogas recovery project
control process efficiency
membrane cost and falling that is the
the the
the i mean like the the key matters
we need to to show to the people
okay so i think that because the time i
need to control the time and it seems to
be is all right
at the moment so thank you very much for
your attention
and uh have a happy day and if you have
any questions please get rice and i try
my best to answer your question
okay okay thank you
okay so uh we uh we already have a few
questions
let me share the slides with you because
we already write it in slides
currently i'm going to share my screen
hello yeah yeah
so we already have questions whether
from youtube or from zoom
uh this is the first question from
youtube from ronnie from research unit
and technology in whitby indonesia i'm
wondering whether there's an optimum
clearly concentration on where to
achieve high chill during
all or is it more to do with wastewater
properties
for instance if there's a concentration
compound in
wastewater will they accumulate in the
reactor instead it goes with the
airplane
maybe you can answer the first question
so
yeah so one by one i will yeah
one by one right uh the first one is
that
whether there's an optimum theory
concentration
or not to achieve a high cod removal
i can answer that question to you is
that
at the moment at the moment it seemed to
be
for the organic loading rate is
much about 10 fold higher than the
arabic mbr
or the other bioreactors so we don't
worry much
about the concentration of the organic
and then the higher organic it seems to
be the better
removal efficiency that means theory
removal efficiency
so when it's less for example like the
municipal
municipal which was the treatment when
we use an elevated mbr
we we have to think of
condense the uh the cod
concentration so that's the reason we
yield the forward omerc because
the higher cod consumption is better for
an elevated mpr
so that is my my my answer because
we don't know we do not have exactly the
optimum theory concentration
or i mean the organic learning rate but
we know is that
higher i mean the better and even much
about five to ten times
i mean organic loading rate for the
inaudible
okay so even the organic shock which i
when shocked
come to suddenly very high and arabic
and you are still very okay all right
so now i just say for instance
just another for instance if there i
mean like
red construction compiles in the wash
water would they accumulate
in the bioreactor instead of glass with
the
effluent for this one
it seemed to be some i can say is that
definitely have a sum
will accumulate in the bioreactor
but if you see the audience how
they accumulate right if they accumulate
in the sludge for example
and then we withdrawals every day or we
recirculate
and then some part we waste in some way
it's still all right and then slot will
go for the treatment then all right but
uh
i tell you it's not the big the the the
matter at the moment because this is a
very i can see if the quant
um the amount is so
so small okay but i can tell you
yes some some they accumulate
all right and then the doctor ian okay i
just want to
to to to tell you about that uh cost and
benefit
analysis in advance and beyond okay
when you want me to tell cost and
benefit a new analysis of
mbr it just only you just asked me about
the
economy bioeconomy
or you want to do to do something
about the cost and benefit analysis and
add a bit npr
i like you to tell me more about that
if about the economy yes
some research already have
already done and then they based on that
uh
based on the the capital cost
operating cost and the saving
the energy energy uh i mean life-saving
or something very positive for an arab
embryo compared to arabic mbr
so that is about the bioeconomy always
say we say circular bioeconomy
is a pretty positive for an arabic
ambiance
okay and then if possible treatment
antibiotic from hospital
wastewater yes my answer is 100
my answer is i mean like the indeed
we can treat the antibiotic from
hospital waste water
no problem at all because we we did a
lot with that the squire was
water in very high concentration of the
antibiotic
and then the removal efficiency is quite
very very high
compared to the other i mean bio
reactors
all right so this is that very i mean
i'm
very confident about the an arabic can
do that
to treat to remove the antibiotic from
hospital fresh water okay
so now to the to the um
right have any suggestion due to how to
separate
ammonia generation during the process
do this person also have any relation
with the bio falling on the membrane
module
okay any suggestion due to how to
separate the
ammonia generation during the process
that is the that is the thing because
as you know is that nitrification
uh the nitrification we need
nitrification
to convert the i mean ammonia
to become the nitrate and then from
denaturation or something like that
first for the inaudible we do not have
air i mean like the the the arabic stage
so in this situation if you only the
i mean like the an arab mbr without any
you know oxygen present
of course in this situation the ammonia
may be is the problem because they
may have to accumulate and then
to do i mean to effect
the i mean like the um the efficiency
okay but in somehow the ammonia
we can combine so that's why the an
element mbr need the hybrid system just
because of that
or we think about we can use animals
okay we can use animals to i mean to
apply for an arabic mbr
for example and then is that
this process i i i think is that
in in in in in my opinion
the bio falling from that
is not significant or even i mean like
it's not really
it because for the bio following just
remember
the bi and that the polysaccharide
and protein that too is really create
the problem with the uh
with the uh what is that with the
biofouling show
from the from the polysaccharide and
and protein the ratio and then we see
the
the smp eps then
we just try to control the memory
folding but it's
very rare to i mean just because of
ammonia i mean generation or something
and in fact the bio foli
okay but yes i mean for the already
falling
yes in somehow yes okay
and uh okay so any more questions
yeah so we will move on to the second
batch of questions
there is two more questions from youtube
yeah
yeah please answer it thank you
uh for the nbr remove color
okay so that is at the moment
very very rare or very furious
to work on the mbr i mean like
uh re um the removal color
by emir
i think that is the i don't know exactly
what that
weather the mbr can do
efficiently remove
the color from the water or the wash
water
but but it's one thing you need to
play around for that because when we
talk about the color
right and then is that if i just say if
i were you
i will use the bio chart
to act inside the mbr
reactor so that means i can use the
biochar
or activated carbon or something like
that
to i mean to add into the
mbr and that kind of mbr either arabic
mbr or an arabic mbr
will work well to remove the color
from wash water or from color from water
okay so this is the thing i suggest that
in somehow
that okay to remove the color
because that's that that that is uh that
is the thing
and then because the membrane what you
see is that
we have the color is that for the two
color
yes two color and apparent color
is something is that about the the the
solid the size of the solid in there
for the two colors normally because of
the
the color the color that when the color
don't matter
in some way is that all the soluble yeah
mainly the soluble
i mean like the solders so then
with the mandarin and then with you you
for example the
other way can you is that you can use
nano filtration
for example then i don't the color will
be
removed well about the
negative that how to control temperature
in an adamant mba of full scale
for that one definitely is that they use
this um
they you the only thing they use unlike
the normal
temperature controller that is very
costly
in fact when we want to increase that uh
the temperature from for example from
the mesophilic
uh 35 degree of 35 centimeter
to 55 cents a degree for the
thermophilic we have to pay a lot of
money
so that is nothing special for that only
the
temperature controller whatever they do
then that is really really
costly and i tell you nothing special at
the moment for inadequate mbr
or i mean like exactly the same they
control
like the lab scale they control like the
pilot scale or something exactly the
same
not nothing special i can tell you about
it
and uh the lv uh heavy
what do you suggest to be controlled
what is that you suggest to be
controlled in an energy system it's a
temperature the ph or maybe the london
right
remember i i i
i don't yeah yeah yeah yeah i haven't
that
for control the inanimate mbr system
just for main parameter i'll show in the
slide already for you
ph temperature hrt
and srt all right
just remember about the login gray about
the
running rate i mentioned the higher the
better
so is all right for that for the loading
rate but
for the temperature ph hrt
and hrt is really really important
really really important
so that means we need to play around
what with these
four parameters okay
uh sofia can it be you on treatment
of the mining
mining we're assuming cn cyanide
that's one okay okay uh my answer is
yes my answer is yes
i mean like the confidence yes
no problem at all okay no problem at all
yes it's all right it's all right but uh
but i just say it but but i
i i say to you need to have some
pre-treatment
need some pre-treatment or you you
integrated
in the greater system that meaning that
in an arabic you add something in
to enhance that uh the
the remove efficiency at the same time
you have to reduce
the inhibitor the inhibitor in that
uh for the meta and methanol zinny
bacterial or i mean some the other
sensitivity with that the toxic
substances or something like that
all right yeah you still have two more
questions
we still have eight minutes okay
two more two more yeah the last two
questions
yeah yeah yeah okay recently watch for
the treatment by using
advanced oxidation process aop become
more concealed method in organic
wastewater treatment yes
metal ozone uv or non-thermal plasma
is a short of the aop yes
what do you think about combination of
mbr method and obesity
do you think the combination could
increase 100
perfect perfect if you really
can use that aop together with the mbr
either arabic mbr or an arab ambiance is
excellent really is that in somehow
especially
i think i can expect the removal
efficiencies
especially from the acne from theory
it should be 100 and also the biogas uh
i mean like the uh what is that the
biogas production should almost go to
the
the the top one i think it's maybe even
even i just see about
um
for the let's go up to the
just that um not only two
two pound something i think only five
kilowatt
okay five kilowatt per cubic meter
theory i think
like that because really high but the
only thing when you do that
yes it's applicable and feasible as well
but uh the economy you need to do the
lca
and then you need to do the economy to
convince the people about the cost
we call that two kind of thing to but to
put together whether the courses go
up higher than the other i mean like the
system
okay novita is there
a bus a possibility that micro pollutant
from wastewater to be
carried over they get over to gas
if yes how to anticipate it
and how to capture iso meeting in wash
water
uh this is that yes the thing is that
is there a possibility that micro
pollutants from wastewater to be carried
out over to gas
the micropollutant is because the reason
is
uh the quantity i just seem to be the
quantity
they can convert to gas yes but it's not
much
not much so this is actually because the
quantity just only be called the
quantity but just
the organi yes so if we do pretty well
the whatever the organic even is not uh
i mean like the something but uh i have
to tell it's a biodegradable
but cannot be non-biodegradable so
biodegradable even that support micro
pollutant yes they can carry over
to gas no problem and how to anticipate
it
is nothing special but i say to you is
that
if you want to carry over to gas then
you have to control well
for the hydrolysis especially hydrology
from the beginning
okay and then go to the second state at
the fermentation in that to stay with
the enzyme
two kind of enzyme and to kind with that
the bacteria then you'll be successful
to convert the micro pollutant
to the biogas all right how to capture
dissolved methane in wash water
this is a very very tough work in fact
so they let the researcher think about
it
and then and then exactly do you think
about the nigeria sign
you think about the niger outside for
example nitrogen oxide
in the wastewater together with methane
and what is their chemical reaction or
biochemical reaction
to make them to release the
the nitrogen and carbon dioxide
so in this situation we do not have
problem with the
the gas the the the methane dissolve
and at the same time we can show the
nitrous
uh oxide this is another i mean like the
greenhouse gas okay greenhouse gas so
nitrate oxide
and then the methane one so this is just
only
i i just say for example so that is the
way to think
and then think about the pressure
for example the pressure and then think
about in
some attract we just say some
attractive or acceptor instead of when
they go
they dissolve to the water we need to
add something
to attract or accept the carbon uh sorry
the meeting
and i say to you the meat end can be
something with the nitrogen oxide
for example that is the way okay that is
the way
to capture the dissolved methane in wash
water but in fact
now with with we with my idea
i like to make the
the meeting completely
release to the to the bio
reactor and then we can collect fully
instead of we use some the other to i
mean to
redo the result meeting
to avoid the global warming problem
okay yeah so
yeah so i think another one or two
minutes
so if anyone's i don't know whether i
have time to
answer more questions but anyway yeah i
don't think it's the last question
because we don't have much time left
maybe
we would like before we end the session
with your
statement maybe professor chandra as
your
colleagues can we want to add like
something
yeah okay thank you very much
uh for very nice lecture
and uh in this room is around
30 in the zoom room but uh
i think in the youtube is more than
uh 100 something participants
watching your lecture i think it's a
very quite interesting
and some of a number of participants
asking
you may share your your presentation or
if it's possible i can send to you no
problem
yes i think there's a number of
participation asking about that
i said no problem no okay okay i will
share
uh to the participants either in the
zoom room or in the uh yeah no problem
no problem
no problem okay thank you very much uh
how so it is very nice and then to have
having you here and we will meet again
maybe in in sydney or in bandung or in
bali
with the participant in this room every
participant in this room cancer
on their cameras and then pose together
with also professional
they will wait first for the
participants to turn on their cameras
and then i will
take the photos by counting down from
tree
[Music]
okay
okay i guess a lot of people has already
turned their cameras on
and i will take the photos by continuing
please give me your warm smile
also to pre-focus on okay
i will start the documentation session
three
two one okay once more
three two
and one okay
thank you professor many thanks to you
thank you thank you thank you i will
send the side to
you okay thank you very much thank you
okay see you see you all again
and have a happy day every day thank you
very much
you